The Hotel End

The Hotel End => Cobblers Corner => Topic started by: Joes Sweet Left Foot on January 12, 2018, 20:25:19 pm



Title: Attacking stats
Post by: Joes Sweet Left Foot on January 12, 2018, 20:25:19 pm
The following stats apply only to league games for this season

All statistics based on the team's attacking potential while players on the pitch either starting the game or as substitute.

Nett Goals per game equivalent is calculated as goals scored per 90 minutes on the pitch

  Best Overall Performers (minimum 5 equivalent games
  Player Minutes Played Goals scored Nett Gls
O'Toole 733 11 1.4
Long  1582 21 1.2
Hoskins  539 7 1.2
Grimes 2193 23 0.9
Foley 786 8 0.9
Powell 1099 11 0.9
Revell  904 9 0.9
Crooks 1422 14 0.9
McGugan 670 6 0.8
Waters 928 7 0.7
Bowditch 471 1 0.2
Richards 709 1 0.1

From these stats alone one might conclude that O'Toole and Long should always start when fit, Hoskins maybe needs a decent run in the team, it is right that Waters has been loaned out to find some form and Bowditch and Richards should be moved on.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: southofthecounty on January 12, 2018, 20:36:23 pm
The following stats apply only to league games for this season

All statistics based on the team's attacking potential while players on the pitch either starting the game or as substitute.

Nett Goals per game equivalent is calculated as goals scored per 90 minutes on the pitch

  Best Overall Performers (minimum 5 equivalent games
  Player Minutes Played Goals scored Nett Gls
O'Toole 733 11 1.4
Long  1582 21 1.2
Hoskins  539 7 1.2
Grimes 2193 23 0.9
Foley 786 8 0.9
Powell 1099 11 0.9
Revell  904 9 0.9
Crooks 1422 19 0.9
McGugan 670 6 0.8
Waters 928 7 0.7
Bowditch 471 1 0.2
Richards 709 1 0.1

From these stats alone one might conclude that O'Toole and Long should always start when fit, Hoskins maybe needs a decent run in the team, it is right that Waters has been loaned out to find some form and Bowditch and Richards should be moved on.

I don't understand. Grimes has scored 23 goals? This season?


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Joes Sweet Left Foot on January 12, 2018, 20:42:14 pm
No, simply means the Cobblers have scored 23 league goals while Grimes was on the pitch, and therefore shares some collective responsibility.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: southofthecounty on January 12, 2018, 20:50:14 pm
No, simply means the Cobblers have scored 23 league goals while Grimes was on the pitch, and therefore shares some collective responsibility.
Ah thanks. That's below his collective responsibility for the goals we've conceded I would imagine. I sometimes wonder if he's colour blind.
Are the stats weighted to give defenders less collective responsibility than forwards?


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Melbourne Cobbler on January 12, 2018, 20:58:38 pm
Ah thanks. That's below his collective responsibility for the goals we've conceded I would imagine. I sometimes wonder if he's colour blind.
Are the stats weighted to give defenders less collective responsibility than forwards?
Good question, and is it accounted for if one of those defenders has played all his 5 games against a team in the bottom half of the table?


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: guest47 on January 12, 2018, 23:07:08 pm
The following stats apply only to league games for this season

All statistics based on the team's attacking potential while players on the pitch either starting the game or as substitute.

Nett Goals per game equivalent is calculated as goals scored per 90 minutes on the pitch

  Best Overall Performers (minimum 5 equivalent games
  Player Minutes Played Goals scored Nett Gls
O'Toole 733 11 1.4
Long  1582 21 1.2
Hoskins  539 7 1.2
Grimes 2193 23 0.9
Foley 786 8 0.9
Powell 1099 11 0.9
Revell  904 9 0.9
Crooks 1422 19 0.9
McGugan 670 6 0.8
Waters 928 7 0.7
Bowditch 471 1 0.2
Richards 709 1 0.1

From these stats alone one might conclude that O'Toole and Long should always start when fit, Hoskins maybe needs a decent run in the team, it is right that Waters has been loaned out to find some form and Bowditch and Richards should be moved on.


The Crooks calculation is way out, should be 1.3


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Joes Sweet Left Foot on January 12, 2018, 23:12:59 pm
Apologies I miskeyed, actually it should have been 14 goals not 19 while Crooks was on the pitch, so it does work out at 0.9 goals per 90 minutes.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Terryfenwickatemyhamster on January 13, 2018, 00:14:07 am
Apologies I miskeyed, actually it should have been 14 goals not 19 while Crooks was on the pitch, so it does work out at 0.9 goals per 90 minutes.

Of course it does.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Buster on January 13, 2018, 08:51:56 am
Fantastic!  We just need an equivalent table for defence and goals conceded.
Then another table for goals scored against teams above us in the table.
Oh and one for goals scored against teams below us.
Of course weíll also want one for goals conceded against teams above us in the table, as well another for goals concede against teams below us.

We then subtract the average goals scored against teams above us, from those below us in the table
Then do the same for goals conceded
Then cross reference the results with the overall tables.
Take a midway point between the overall table and the calculated results and hey presto - the team picks itself




Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Cobbler78 on January 13, 2018, 09:08:25 am
I don't understand. Grimes has scored 23 goals? This season?

🙄 this guy though 🙄


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Cobbler78 on January 13, 2018, 09:12:28 am
Very interesting stats, thanks.

In Ice Hockey they have a +\- stat. Quite simply if youíre on the pitch when we score you get +1 and if youíre on the pitch when we concede you get -1. Can anyone work this out for us? Iíd suggest JJOT would top this.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Monkey on January 13, 2018, 09:25:57 am
We'd also need to know if those goals were scored or conceded against better teams too


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Zen Master on January 13, 2018, 09:28:02 am
And for home games were the starlings flying in a murmuration?


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Melbourne Cobbler on January 13, 2018, 09:46:20 am
Whilst this is interesting stuff there is a much easier way of working out if we will win a game or not that is readily available on this site already you know?


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: BedsCobb on January 13, 2018, 10:48:27 am
Any stats relating to a struggling side make awful reading.
Lets hope to see a massive improvement over the last 20 odd games with our new recruits ripping league 1 a revengeful new one😉


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Joes Sweet Left Foot on January 13, 2018, 11:01:01 am
And for home games were the starlings flying in a murmuration?

I have got stats on this, but as there appears to be no statistical correlation I thought it better not to publish.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Zen Master on January 13, 2018, 11:46:57 am
Probably a wise move. i often find them a useful distraction from the game


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Boot and shoe on January 13, 2018, 13:45:05 pm
Thatís an excellent set of statistics - clearly you have too much time on your hands !
The one thing I take from the list is that Rico has played 25 minutes less than JJOT but 10 less goals have been scored . Thatís pretty damning and confirms what most people think .


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: southofthecounty on January 13, 2018, 13:50:55 pm
🙄 this guy though 🙄
It had been a long day ALRIGHT!


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Cobbler78 on January 14, 2018, 19:07:42 pm
Very interesting stats, thanks.

In Ice Hockey they have a +\- stat. Quite simply if youíre on the pitch when we score you get +1 and if youíre on the pitch when we concede you get -1. Can anyone work this out for us? Iíd suggest JJOT would top this.

Can anyone be bothered to work this out, itís will be quite time consuming with the timings of subs and goals. As if to prove what we already know, JJOT was +2 yesterday in a one goal win. John-Joe plays, we do better than when he doesnít.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Cobbler78 on January 14, 2018, 19:38:54 pm
Can anyone be bothered to work this out, itís will be quite time consuming with the timings of subs and goals. As if to prove what we already know, JJOT was +2 yesterday in a one goal win. John-Joe plays, we do better than when he doesnít.

This tweet from James Heneghan goes part was to proving the above.

Doing a quick bit of statting.
#NTFC's record when O'Toole starts this season: P11 W6 D2 L3 (win % 55)
#NTFC's record when O'Toole doesn't start: P24 W2 D7 L15 (win % 8)

For all the talk of new signings, keeping him fit is a must.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Melbourne Cobbler on January 14, 2018, 22:22:26 pm
This tweet from James Heneghan goes part was to proving the above.

Doing a quick bit of statting.
#NTFC's record when O'Toole starts this season: P11 W6 D2 L3 (win % 55)
#NTFC's record when O'Toole doesn't start: P24 W2 D7 L15 (win % 8)

For all the talk of new signings, keeping him fit is a must.
We touched on this a couple of weeks ago didnít we 78? Genuine question because I am not clever enough to work it out, which is easier? 1. Points gained in a game against a side in the bottom half of the table without JJ in the side. 2. Points gained in a game against a side in the top half of the table if JJ is playing?


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Cobbler78 on January 14, 2018, 22:25:08 pm
We touched on this a couple of weeks ago didnít we 78? Genuine question because I am not clever enough to work it out, which is easier? 1. Points gained in a game against a side in the bottom half of the table without JJ in the side. 2. Points gained in a game against a side in the top half of the table if JJ is playing?

Statistically the bottom half game is easier, however, this JJOT anomaly might even things up, but of a grey area this.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: southofthecounty on January 14, 2018, 22:36:25 pm
Statistically the bottom half game is easier, however, this JJOT anomaly might even things up, but of a grey area this.
Mornington Crescent! (Do I win?)


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Melbourne Cobbler on January 14, 2018, 22:39:37 pm
Statistically the bottom half game is easier, however, this JJOT anomaly might even things up, but of a grey area this.
It occurred to me that if JJ in the side against teams in the top half was statistically more advantageous, then that factor would potentially ring true for other sides as well? Therefore in our case an easier game against us is dictated by whether JJ plays and not our position in the table? Not saying it is, just thought it was a valid point?


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Cobbler78 on January 14, 2018, 22:50:20 pm
It occurred to me that if JJ in the side against teams in the top half was statistically more advantageous, then that factor would potentially ring true for other sides as well? Therefore in our case an easier game against us is dictated by whether JJ plays and not our position in the table? Not saying it is, just thought it was a valid point?

No, sorry, itís not a valid point.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Melbourne Cobbler on January 15, 2018, 01:37:33 am
No, sorry, itís not a valid point.
ok, my mistake!


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Wolvo on January 15, 2018, 09:45:52 am
It occurred to me that if JJ in the side against teams in the top half was statistically more advantageous, then that factor would potentially ring true for other sides as well? Therefore in our case an easier game against us is dictated by whether JJ plays and not our position in the table? Not saying it is, just thought it was a valid point?

Maybe JJ really is a No. 10 type midfielder after all as well...


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Deepcut Cobbler on January 15, 2018, 10:27:16 am
Maybe JJ really is a No. 10 type midfielder after all as well...

Seems to do well, as do we, when he plays alongside Long...


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Boot and shoe on January 15, 2018, 10:45:41 am
Seems to do well, as do we, when he plays alongside Long...
Credit has to go to both JFH and John Joe because every time another manager has tried to play him in that role it hasnít worked. Most people think JJOT is a holding midfield player .
The stats speak for themselves , as do his performances .
He really is the talisman of this team and everything lifts around him.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Cobbler78 on January 15, 2018, 10:46:28 am
Seems to do well, as do we, when he plays alongside Long...

This is because Long canít/wonít challenge for the ball in the air, he needs to play alongside someone who does.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Wolvo on January 15, 2018, 11:40:42 am
Credit has to go to both JFH and John Joe because every time another manager has tried to play him in that role it hasnít worked. Most people think JJOT is a holding midfield player .
The stats speak for themselves , as do his performances .
He really is the talisman of this team and everything lifts around him.

Agreed. A goal and an assist (plus no bookings!).

I reckon this hasn't worked previously due to us having Richards as our main striker and their playing styles may have clashed?


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: DrillingCobbler on January 15, 2018, 11:57:39 am
JJ is being utilised in that position simply because we don't have any other 'bully' to link up the attack with the midfield. Which is whats needed when Long is playing at the top of the tree.

JJ's presence there also ensures that the quality of the oppositions balls out from defence are lower, which in turn helps the less combative midfielders to break up play. Defending from the front and all thatÖ

Take JJ out of the team and we become a disjointed, unbalanced side and the lack of pace becomes far more noticeable. JFH is clearly trying to bring pace back into the team across the board but that will take time as he integrates the new signings into the starting line up.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: bri77 on January 17, 2018, 14:01:01 pm
Even if JJ isn't having the best of games he is such a pain for the opposition his influence on the game will always be there.

He's pretty close to becoming my favourite Cobblers player ever.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Joes Sweet Left Foot on January 30, 2018, 13:11:51 pm
The following stats apply only to league games

All statistics based on the players contribution on the pitch either starting the game or as substitute.

  Best Overall Performers (min 5 equiv. games)
Player Minutes Equiv Goals Goals Nett Nett gls/
Played Games Scored Conceded Goals 90 mins
O'Toole 1001 11 16 14 2 +0.18
Hoskins 738 8 12 11 1 +0.12
Long 1848 21 26 32 -6 -0.29
Powell 1137 13 11 17 -6 -0.47
Crooks 1674 19 19 30 -11 -0.59
McWilliams 696 8 6 11 -5 -0.65
Ingram 1800 20 17 30 -13 -0.65
A.Taylor 2656 30 27 48 -21 -0.71
Pierre 1602 18 15 28 -13 -0.73
Poole 1546 17 13 28 -15 -0.87
Buchanan 2340 26 23 46 -23 -0.88
Foley 967 11 12 22 -10 -0.93
Revell 909 10 9 19 -10 -0.99
Moloney 1936 22 17 39 -22 -1.02
Waters 928 10 7 20 -13 -1.26
Cornell 540 6 5 13 -8 -1.33
McGugan 670 7 6 17 -11 -1.48
Bowditch 471 5 1 9 -8 -1.53
Barnett 665 7 5 17 -12 -1.62
Richards 709 8 1 17 -16 -2.03


  Best Overall Performers (5 equiv. games or less )
  Player Minutes Equiv Goals Goals Nett Nett gls/
Played Games Scored Conceded Goals 90 mins
Facey 360 4 8 4 4 +1.00
O'Donnell 270 3 5 3 2 +0.67
Turnbull 270 3 5 3 2 +0.67
Bunney 173 2 3 2 1 +0.52
Pereira 61 1 1 1 0 +0.00
Ariyidi 24 0 0 0 0 +0.00
M.Taylor 64 1 0 0 0 +0.00
Smith 388 4 3 5 -2 -0.46
Kasim 370 4 4 6 -2 -0.49
Hanley 231 3 0 4 -4 -1.56
Phillips 87 1 0 2 -2 -2.07
Coddington 90 1 1 4 -3 -3.00


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Cobbler78 on January 30, 2018, 13:14:29 pm
The following stats apply only to league games

All statistics based on the players contribution on the pitch either starting the game or as substitute.

  Best Overall Performers (min 5 equiv. games)
Player Minutes Equiv Goals Goals Nett Nett gls/
Played Games Scored Conceded Goals 90 mins
O'Toole 1001 11 16 14 2 +0.18
Hoskins 738 8 12 11 1 +0.12
Long 1848 21 26 32 -6 -0.29
Powell 1137 13 11 17 -6 -0.47
Crooks 1674 19 19 30 -11 -0.59
McWilliams 696 8 6 11 -5 -0.65
Ingram 1800 20 17 30 -13 -0.65
A.Taylor 2656 30 27 48 -21 -0.71
Pierre 1602 18 15 28 -13 -0.73
Poole 1546 17 13 28 -15 -0.87
Buchanan 2340 26 23 46 -23 -0.88
Foley 967 11 12 22 -10 -0.93
Revell 909 10 9 19 -10 -0.99
Moloney 1936 22 17 39 -22 -1.02
Waters 928 10 7 20 -13 -1.26
Cornell 540 6 5 13 -8 -1.33
McGugan 670 7 6 17 -11 -1.48
Bowditch 471 5 1 9 -8 -1.53
Barnett 665 7 5 17 -12 -1.62
Richards 709 8 1 17 -16 -2.03


  Best Overall Performers (5 equiv. games or less )
  Player Minutes Equiv Goals Goals Nett Nett gls/
Played Games Scored Conceded Goals 90 mins
Facey 360 4 8 4 4 +1.00
O'Donnell 270 3 5 3 2 +0.67
Turnbull 270 3 5 3 2 +0.67
Bunney 173 2 3 2 1 +0.52
Pereira 61 1 1 1 0 +0.00
Ariyidi 24 0 0 0 0 +0.00
M.Taylor 64 1 0 0 0 +0.00
Smith 388 4 3 5 -2 -0.46
Kasim 370 4 4 6 -2 -0.49
Hanley 231 3 0 4 -4 -1.56
Phillips 87 1 0 2 -2 -2.07
Coddington 90 1 1 4 -3 -3.00


Excellent work. Look how close all those at the bottom are to our current starting 11


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Cobbler78 on February 02, 2018, 13:51:20 pm
With all the chat of stats and facts, the more interesting thread has fallen under the radar. These really are great stats and shows why the players were released.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: EssTeeFree on February 02, 2018, 14:17:57 pm
Interesting to see Hoskins so high in that table, especially given how often he is derided on here. Is he more important to us than he gets credit for, lucky that his games have largely coincided with JJOTs or is he an anomaly?


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: cj on February 02, 2018, 14:23:54 pm
Interesting to see Hoskins so high in that table, especially given how often he is derided on here. Is he more important to us than he gets credit for, lucky that his games have largely coincided with JJOTs or is he an anomaly?
Must be in some kind of symbiotic relationship with the Toole I think. Definitely not the second MVP for us imo.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: EssTeeFree on February 02, 2018, 14:30:04 pm
Must be in some kind of symbiotic relationship with the Toole I think. Definitely not the second MVP for us imo.

Generally agree with you. I do think he has some value, just not in the traditional winger sense. He does put a shift in and is usually pretty diligent at helping out his full back. I also reckon over the last few games with him and Foley wide the teams we have played have shut his side down a lot more, while giving a bit more space to Foley, probably thinking they can get back at him due to his lack of pace. I thought it was noticeable against southend that Hoskins got more space when Berto came on.

I don't think he is a winger though, his best position is behind the striker imo. Obviously he is behind O'Toole for that role but I wouldn't mind seeing him play behind Van Veen with O'Toole deeper in some games.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: threeinabed on February 02, 2018, 14:31:50 pm
Generally agree with you. I do think he has some value, just not in the traditional winger sense. He does put a shift in and is usually pretty diligent at helping out his full back. I also reckon over the last few games with him and Foley wide the teams we have played have shut his side down a lot more, while giving a bit more space to Foley, probably thinking they can get back at him due to his lack of pace. I thought it was noticeable against southend that Hoskins got more space when Berto came on.

I don't think he is a winger though, his best position is behind the striker imo. Obviously he is behind O'Toole for that role but I wouldn't mind seeing him play behind Van Veen with O'Toole deeper in some games.

i think hoskins is way down the list on playing anywhere central for us.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: EssTeeFree on February 02, 2018, 14:38:37 pm
i think hoskins is way down the list on playing anywhere central for us.

Don't disagree, can't see Jimmy ever picking him there. It is shame though, while he is far from being the messiah I think he could do a decent job behind / supporting a striker like Van Veen. Don't really like him at all as a winger though.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: Joes Sweet Left Foot on February 02, 2018, 15:17:21 pm
Personally I think Hoskins is underrated. He always puts in a shift, can break at pace, probably wins more free-kicks than anyone else which leads to break in play and attacking opportunities. He also fulfills his defensive duties. His best position is probably right side midfield.


Title: Re: Attacking stats
Post by: 606 Parklands_Cobbler on February 02, 2018, 15:20:35 pm
Whatever he is, He is not a striker anymore. 12 in 89 games for us. He's still played in attacking positions. But I still like him too.