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1  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Players Under/Out of Contract 19/20 Season on: March 26, 2019, 14:40:01 pm
Exactly why you need an U23s. That list [of players] is likely to become greater, in the very near future.

Yes, there definitely seems to be room for something between youth and first team. If we had an U23's is there a league structure for them to play in?
2  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Players Under/Out of Contract 19/20 Season on: March 26, 2019, 13:32:48 pm
The criticism is for starting them over the more experienced players.  There is a time to introduce 16 year-olds to first team action and Saturday was not that time.  Its no coincidence that when you look at our recent defeats, we were giving full debuts to youth team players...

I get that criticism completely and don't really disagree with it. The point I was trying to make is that there is an element of him being damned if he does, damned if he doesn't. A cursory look at the Views on Curle thread, around page 16 shows a number of criticisms of Curle for ignoring the youth. I've just looked again and all of the below was posted within a page or two;

None of the players mentioned are our assets nor likely to be at the club in the medium term. Meanwhile, the star u-18's barely get an inroad

On Hughes:
The centre back on loan at St Neots. Played more men's games than any of the others. Very tall, left-footed, brave and can play a bit. No sign of him getting a chance. Not sure he is in KC's plans. That goes for a few others. Doesn't matter how highly they are thought of in the academy, KC has final decision. If he doesn't rate them, they will be released in the near future.
It's why I mentioned the centre back. He has the physicality to men's football

On Roberts:
Morgan has the skill, pace and awareness to be the next Michael Jacobs but what he does not have is experience, which I hope he gets once we are safe in League 2 this season (along with 2 or 3 others).
Yes he is slight but Messi and Silva seem to cope!

On the others:
We have got probably the best crop of youngsters we have ever had and maybe we should do a ď Gareth SouthgateĒ just a thought ....
I do accept that too many of them in the same team is dangerous , as exemplified at Cambridge when I believe they were thrown under the bus
It would be great if we could take our Golden Generation and take them through to the first team under the guidance of their mentor !
Itís not going to happen , as you suggest but what an acheivment that would be

Now, there is nothing inherently wrong with most of those quotes in isolation, the point I made in my original post was that it is difficult to blood more than 1 or 2 youngsters properly in a season. I think it is valid criticism that both Williams and Hughes shouldn't have started at the weekend but how do these two get the experience they need if they can't both play at the same time. Do you drop one in for 5 games, then the other? What happens when all the experience pro's are fit and available? How many games would those who advocate the youth be happy with each of them getting in a season? Also, in Hughes case, you don't often get the chance to chuck a Centre Back on as a sub.

I'm sure it can be done but trying to give sufficient game time to Hughes, J Williams, S McWilliams, C McWilliams, Roberts, Pollock and Iacafiano (all have been mentioned when criticising Curle's approach to youth) through the same season without some blips for them and the team is nigh on impossible, I think. Again I say all this as someone who is not Curle's biggest fan.

3  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Players Under/Out of Contract 19/20 Season on: March 25, 2019, 16:29:20 pm
I agree entirely - all of the youth players including Jay Williams are all very slight.  Thatís one of the biggest differences between premiership/championship youngsters and ours - their kids are noticeably bigger. Surely all it would take is for our fitness coaches to just copy what the top clubs do in terms of weight training etc or am I being naive?

Honestly I do think that is a little naÔve yes. Physical development will be a very individual thing. Almost the worst thing you do to a Morgan Roberts for example is say "have you seen the size of that Jadon Sancho, do exactly the same programme as him". That's the path to long term injury, I might be wrong but I think Lewis Hornby would be our canary in the coal mine on that front.

The club have sports scientists and strength and conditioning coaches, these guys wont always get it right but they will know what they are doing. The youth team have just appointed a full time sports scientist as well I believe.

I'll be honest, I've not been Curle's biggest fan but I do think he can't really win with the young players. I think it is on the 'views on Curle' thread that Meccano, Boot & Shoe and Mathius have all said things along the line of him not rating them, not being interested in them, that we are in danger of losing our golden generation. He is then criticised by others for playing them over more experienced options. It show's how difficult it is to blood a large number of youngsters in the same season. Ideally you want 1 or 2 to break through per season so you can drop them in and out of the team for periods and let them develop, both physically and mentally.
4  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Cheltenham Town (A) 23.03.19 on: March 23, 2019, 17:54:35 pm
Poor selection with play offs a possibility. He could definitely have picked a better and more experienced side!

Iím expecting 2 or 3 posters in particular to be on here later to defend the selection today given how critical they were of Curle for ignoring our youth players over the last month or so.
5  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: March 21, 2019, 10:52:34 am
The beauty of football is you will have poor season's where you don't reach expectations,  it just means it takes a year longer

You are still not answering the question Beds, you are still following your happy path to success.

The bit above is simply not true under the model you proposed. If you sell the boxes and season tickets for 3 years in advance and for whatever reason (luck / injuries / manager) the team has an awful season and gets relegated in the second year, no one turns up the third year. What then? You have no gate income to speak of because you spent the season ticket money 2 years ago, you have higher running costs, less money from being in a lower league, sponsorship drops. That will not delay things for a year, that will cost you 5 years at least. Not to mention that, being community owned, there will be no rich owner propping up the club to protect their investment, whatever their motives.

I honestly think it is good that you have some ideas that could form part of a plan or strategy but you simply cannot operate on the basis that you hope it will work. That is exactly how most clubs have gone to the wall, regardless of their ownership model.
6  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: March 20, 2019, 21:37:40 pm
Again assuming Thomas will be gone allowing the Town and support base to get on board with building up our football club.
The boxes would be sorted easily and should've been done years ago, absolutely no excuses for the ridiculous excuses and delay.
 the capacity increase would require us to have a good run in league 1 to make it work a treat, not getting out of league 2 would delay it, but if we're ever going to resemble a truely professional club, getting out of the basement is a must.
We have 1000s not turning up due to a lack of direction and ambition within every aspect of the club, that would also need addressing.

Sorry, either I donít understand or you havenít answered my question. I get that you want the boxes built, extra seats etc, I get that you have an idea to fund it by selling boxes and season tickets in advance, with the idea that the shortfall in future seasons is covered by extra people coming through the turnstiles. My question is, what happens if, for whatever reason, these extra punters donít show up?

In season 3 there is no more season ticket money as you got all that in season 1 and spent it on infrastructure. How do you cover the running costs in season 3 if gates donít increase, or indeed go down?

Just to be completely clear, I know you believe the people will show, just treat this as a hypothetical question if you need to.
7  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: March 20, 2019, 19:47:42 pm
By the third season the slack would be more than taken up by new supporters attracted to a more professional ground and the many extra ticket sales to visiting fans and the general increase due to interest.

What would be your contingency if that didnít happen? Letís say we have a poor manager or an injury crisis that leads to the team struggling and the fans stay away. What then?
8  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Cheltenham Town (A) 23.03.19 on: March 20, 2019, 19:40:49 pm
Hardly an Ian Atkins side though .
Of all those mentioned , I would say only Pierre and JJOT truly use physicality in their game .
Yup, agree, I was just referring to the perception from outside. Like I say if you fit 4 central defenders and a taller striker into the team youíll inevitably be seen that way. Those who see us every week will know different of course
9  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: March 20, 2019, 18:44:47 pm
The Man couldnt even organising of raising of £1m to fit out a few boxes  resturant/ toilet block in the east stand , this couldve been done easily 2 years back and wouldve been a valuble asset that would've near paid for itself by now.
I dont expect him to build a much as a garden shed let alone a velodrome!

All of that might be true but none of it means I have to think the trust proposal is strong or been well executed to date. They are two separate things, why do you insist on treating them as one?

All the chairman's friends had obvious angst due to the trusts brilliant coup in acquiring community asset order on the ground and running track, how many of you offered congratulations on saving our town all this valuble land?

No angst from me but congratulations yet either (see, again not everything is a binary choice) because Iím yet to understand how this move will benefit the club longer term. Will they take profits from the swimming pool for example? Thatís not a dig, itís a genuine question.

By the way, who does the ďyouĒ Iíve bolded refer? If Iím reading it right it refers to the putting me in the chairmanís friends group you mentioned earlier in the paragraph. Once again, for the avoidance of any doubt, just because I donít agree with the trusts proposals and actions to date does not mean I support Thomas. I really hope that is clear, Iím not sure what other language to put it in for you!

The attack on the flyer was reaction to this order thus allowing our club to retain this land and not have it annexed into private ownership with little to no benefit to our club or town.
Let them know what you want for our club, it could prove popular.

Finally, my view on the flyer has nothing to do with Thomas, Cardoza, Land, League 2, JFH, Page or anything other than the content of it and the ham fisted way it was produced/presented and defended by the trust. Iím really not sure what is so hard to understand about that.
10  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Cheltenham Town (A) 23.03.19 on: March 20, 2019, 17:49:53 pm
Everyone seems to think we are a “ strong arm “ team and so surely it’s in the opposition’s favour that we are refereed by this pillock .
I don’t get the accusation at all . Compared to some of our sides of old we are powder puff !
I wouldn’t exactly say the likes of Hoskins , Powell , Powell , Buchanan , Bridge , Turnbull , Williams and Morias for example are out of the John Gayle mould .

I think this is more about perception based on a few factors. If you look at our likely team it contains 4 players who would count themselves as central defenders. Foley and O'Toole are probably seen as physical midfield players and I would think A.Williams is also seen as a more physical front man. That leaves Buchs who would be seen as competitor by opposition teams. Therefore only D.Powell and Hoskins from our starting 11 don't fit the mould.
11  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: March 20, 2019, 17:41:15 pm
Fair point,.. but how are we ever going to know which way the majority of our fan base and general public would like to see our club go?
Some want a challenging league 1 club with a ground that allows the club to be sustainable.
Others like many on here want a Cardozas/ Thomas style existence in which we allow secretive regimes rule over us for 2 decades and do what it is they do in hope everything will be ok!
There needs to be  trust led initiatives to allow discussion to take place.
Those on here getting precious over the wording on a flyer are obviously in the former camp and therefore killing off any opposition.

I'm sorry but this is nonsense. Once again your lumping everyone into one of two camps. I'll repeat it again, it is absolutely possible to not support the current trust approach without automatically supporting Thomas' approach.

I have (what I believe to be) legitimate concerns about the way the trust have gone about things, that doesn't mean I believe Thomas to be the second coming.

To boil those concerns down to 'wording on a flyer' is insulting. Incidentally, don't even try and tell me that if the club had released anything of that ilk the likes of Random, Manwork and yourself wouldn't have jumped all over it. There's plenty of references made to Thomas' 'power points' on here by way of criticism. Let alone what you might say if Thomas wanted to build a Velodrome!
12  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: March 20, 2019, 14:39:11 pm
My thinking exactly Beds, chairman can do nothing and they are happy, some fans want better and is picked apart immediately.

Why does it have to be one or the other? Can you not understand that there are fans out there who are unhappy with how both parties are approaching things?
13  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Fan Ownership on: March 15, 2019, 09:53:54 am
If you listen to this week's podcast, you might just find out  Wink Cool

Is this the podcast equivalent of clickbait?  Grin

14  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Fan Ownership on: March 14, 2019, 15:30:11 pm
Don't know but I saw Keith flick through the tactical bits of the document in the technical area on Tuesday night just before the late substitutions which led to the goal.


I did notice the club had a sly dig at the document when they tweeted the footage of Powell's goal as well. Clearly been seen within the club, no doubt it will have rattled a few cages. I'm sure a lot of people will have a view on whether that is good or bad!
15  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Fan Ownership on: March 14, 2019, 14:34:15 pm
What was the official line on the document that was released in the end? Have the Trust clarified how it came into being and why it wasn't endorsed by the Trust Board?
16  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Newport County (h) 12th March on: March 13, 2019, 12:34:41 pm
It's not hard to see what Curle has been doing since the Colchester game, even more so in the last few weeks. Back four wit h2 solid, defensive full backs, arguably our most robust midfield 3, the only bit of pace we can possibly field out wide and a strong, hard working lone front man. It is working results wise, I wouldn't expect him to deviate away from it too much this season. Let's see what he does in the summer.

Always easy to say but if it was me I'd take this base and tweak a little.
Same back 4
Any 2 of JJOT, Foley, Turnbull, McWilliams in midfield
3 behind the striker made up of any 2 of JPowell, Elsnik, Bridge plus 1 of DPowell or Hoskins
Williams or Sordell up front.
If Morais plays up front play JJOT in behind for some aerial presence.

Then look to upgrade a few key components in the summer, mainly in the attacking 4
17  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Fan Ownership on: March 12, 2019, 18:34:12 pm
Something that Northampton Town have achieved ONCE in the last FIFTY SIX years of private ownership !

So what youíre saying is Private Ownership 1-0 Fan Ownership  Tongue

18  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Fan Ownership on: March 12, 2019, 11:26:53 am
I'm very open minded about fan ownership and understand that there are various models we could follow. However the last couple of pages of this thread have really brought all my concerns to the fore.

Whatever the truth about the document, the whole affair is a huge embarrassment. It simply points to the fact that the Trust and it's board are not all singing from the same hymn sheer, which should be the bare minimum.

I also find it a little concerning that, in the report from the meeting it states that a proposal has already been taken to the club, which includes the backing of a mystery investor. Surely nothing should ever have got that far without it being put to the fans first?

Maybe I am extremely naÔve but I believe the only way this works is if the trust are completely transparent with the fan base. If all we are going to do is swap one group of people who can decide what the fan base is worthy of knowing for another then what do we really gain? The fact that one group of people are fans doesn't make a huge difference, I only have to spend 5 minutes on here to know that I have different opinions on the way things are done to many other fans.
19  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Views on Keith Curle on: February 14, 2019, 09:45:43 am
As B&S has alluded to elsewhere it will be very interesting to see what team he puts out on Saturday on the back of 2 improved, backs to the wall, defensive away games with a lone forward. Will he go with the same which would be pretty negative for a home game or will he change it again?

Do you mean the style of play used the last two games or playing 1 up front being negative (or both)?

There is nothing negative about playing 1 up front as long as the team's general style is positive and the 2 attacking midfielders behind the striker (and to some extent the wing-backs) are given enough freedom. That's often more attacking than a standard 3-5-2 IMO
20  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Fan Ownership on: February 08, 2019, 16:23:41 pm
The only problem at the minute is as a direct result of our current board total failure of running our football club ie: massively overspending on crap players .....

Sorry to selectively quote, how would it be a guarantee that a fan owned / community / JVP or whatever the model is would not make poor signings, or indeed poor management appointments?

I'm very much in favour of the process the trust are going through to investigate options but I do feel it is all undermined when people post things on here that suggest we would not have had the struggles of the last couple of seasons if we were under some kind of fan ownership, as if it is fact.

Anything that sells fan ownership as a quick fix completely misses the point in my opinion. I would really hope it was a seriously long term vision that is put forward, if it is to tide us over until the next private owner buys us (e.g. Portsmouth) then what is the point?
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