DuncanSpeddingsLeftFoot
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« on: July 31, 2014, 07:09:40 am » |
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Mods feel free to merge this with the Cardoza Out thread - wanted to get a vote going.
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DrillingCobbler
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« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2014, 07:14:29 am » |
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Like with all leaders, he will live or die by his sword. So option 2!
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AidyMannsDog
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« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2014, 07:32:42 am » |
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Go on Dave put it up for sale in "The Gulf News"
You only live once, lets have some fun FFS.
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Gen.Disorda
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« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2014, 08:00:49 am » |
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I just think this whole thing is a storm in a teapot. There is questions to be answered, But lets not jump to conclusions. Things have escalated rather quickly on this board, with a few posters creating a panic.
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felipefelop
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« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2014, 10:18:39 am » |
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I just think this whole thing is a storm in a teapot. There is questions to be answered, But lets not jump to conclusions. Things have escalated rather quickly on this board, with a few posters creating a panic. +1
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bungle
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« Reply #5 on: July 31, 2014, 11:10:06 am » |
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How about an option 6:
This is a ridiculous poll and any moron who votes for DC to go without A. waiting to see the completed redevelopment in the flesh, and B. suggesting a viable alternative to his chairmanship, really needs their head examined.
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The 12th Marquis of Sixfields
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« Reply #6 on: July 31, 2014, 11:22:28 am » |
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How about he continues to own the club but hands over the chairmanship to somebody with any sort of an idea in what they're doing? Like should have happened in about 2004. If you'd like a viable alternative, well surely that would happen when you advertise the job and then interview the candidates and look at their past achievements in the world of doing this sort of thing. You then pick the one you feel will take the company forward best. Just an idea.
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The Hotelend Grand National Sweepstake Champion 2023
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LondonCobbler81
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« Reply #7 on: July 31, 2014, 11:25:15 am » |
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Sorry, I posted this in the re-development thread rather than here, although it is probably relevant to both! I will delete the other if I can work it out, or indeed if it is possible.
My two pence worth Firstly, an introduction. I am a long-time viewer of this board, generally with a view to keeping up to date with cobblers news and gossip, rather than enter into arguments dialogue with the posters. However, I feel passionate about the vitriol being spouted about David Cardoza and felt I had to post my views.
I fail to understand any of the arguments against David Cardoza. I consider him to have been a very good chairman who has had the best interest of the club at heart since day one. Additionally he has always focussed on the right areas, growing non-match day income to make the club sustainable (e.g. conferencing facilities, hotel etc).
I have addressed my largest gripes with some of the arguments made on this board below.
Delays The delays in achieving these goals over the last 10 years have been through no fault of his, rather they are the fault of the council and the ridiculous number of local government and quasi government organisations with an interest in the Sixfields site (to my knowledge Northampton Borough Council, the East Northampton Development Association and English Partnerships).
I fail to understand any issue with a delay of "a few weeks" in completing the development, to be honest, I would not be concerned with a delay of a few months. For me it is about the long-term direction.
Number of seats We have taken on a significant loan in order to complete these works. That loan needs to be serviced. Therefore the money needs to be invested in projects that will make a return for the club immediately.
I'm not sure how many times in the last few seasons Sixfields has been sold out (no doubt someone can inform me), but I would hazard a guess that it is less than 5% of games. As such I would guess that very little income has been lost on an annual basis by not having the extra seats. Certainly not enough income lost to service the loan taken on.
Undoubtedly should the team move up the football ladder and be challenging at the right end of league one, the opportunity cost of fewer seats would be larger. But that can be addressed with adding extra seats relatively easily when we are in that situation, it is a nice problem to have.
Until we are in that position the priority must be income generating projects, the conferencing facilities, the corporate entertainment and the hotel. This may not excite the fans, but it is about putting in place the longer-term building blocks to support a larger club in the future. A stronger underlying financial position now will make the building of extra seats as and when they are required easier in the future.
Additionally, based on our recent attendances, I for one, believe that you get a better atmosphere in a 60% full stadium than we would if we had a 12,000 capacity stadium with 4,500 in attendance.
Cardoza is just looking for a return on his investment I am reminded of a quote I heard whilst studying Finance at university, "Eleven grown men, kicking a bit of dead cow around a field is not somewhere to invest your money".
The point is, investing in a football team is an extremely high risk if you are looking for a return on your investment, especially in the lower leagues. It is almost certain to fail.
The Cardozas took control of the club when it was faced with entering formal insolvency proceedings, I do not recall there being any other credible offers for the club at the time. Insolvency for a club like Northampton could well have resulted in liquidation and the club ceasing to exist. If a club as large as Portsmouth can flirt with non-existence then believe me, Northampton Town could easily have gone down that route.
I have looked up the recent financial accounts for the club. They appear to be small company accounts and are abbreviated to just a balance sheet, as such they do not offer the full picture of the club's trading position. However, from what I can garner from the accounts, the club appears to be more or less break even (with a small profit in the year ended 30 June 2013). This is some achievement given that the club was losing around £1 million per annum when Cardoza took over.
Significant investment was required in the early years just to fund the losses and ensure that a Northampton Town Football Club remained in business. So, if the income from the sale of players such as Johnson and Bunn went into funding some losses rather than being reinvested in the team so that Cardoza didn't have to put his hand in his own pocket for even more that year, then who would begrudge him that? Not me.
The only way of seeing any of that investment returned is, ultimately, to be a more successful club, with larger attendances, in a higher division. If this is the aim of the chairman, then it is aligned with the aim of the fans. The goals are not mutually exclusive, far from it.
However, at the end of the day, it's his club and he can do what he wants with it anyway. Perhaps this is the problem with football ownership via corporate entities in this country, but that is another debate altogether.
Just put the club up for sale and see what interest there is This is intrinsically related to the above point. If Cardoza put the club on the market you would have to assume that he felt that he could take it no further and felt it was unlikely that his investment would ever be returned, even in part. Because the club is worth nothing, or close to it at this point in time.
I would be extremely concerned as a cobblers fan if this was the position, as I would expect the serious interest in the club to be precisely nil. This would leave us staring at the void of liquidation and non-existence again.
Cardoza doesn't keep the fans informed Perhaps this is just a difference of opinion, but I think he has kept the fans informed throughout. He is running a business and has no obligation to account to the fans for every move he makes. Nevertheless he provides numerous updates on the site and makes himself available frequently at open forums, what more do you want?
Sorry for the length of this diatribe, as I said, I feel quite passionately about this issue, as I feel that Cardoza has been an exceptional chairman, who has always had the right goals when it comes to growing the club and taking it to a higher level on limited resources.
Until now those plans were thwarted by the council and others over a number of years, with regards to the planning consent for the conferencing, hotel etc, that can drive some real value for the club. To be honest I'm surprised he didn't jack it in a while ago and leave us high and dry.
We now have those plans progressing and I am genuinely excited by the prospects for the club going forward. So if it takes a few extra weeks to complete a few extra seats, who gives a ****.
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bungle
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« Reply #8 on: July 31, 2014, 11:35:21 am » |
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Great first post, London.
Unfortunately, there are people on here who lack the patience and long term vision to accept what you're saying. They need to be careful what they wish for.
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everbrite
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« Reply #9 on: July 31, 2014, 11:45:06 am » |
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+1
I agree a rare voice of moderation and sensibility
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2020 Grand National S/S 3rd Place
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Trotty
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I've lost faith in anything the chairman says a long time ago. I've no doubt his motives are good but he doesn't do himself any favours by continuing to tell fans what they want to hear rather than being honest with them. Sure that will be enough to appease some but for a lot he's lost his credibility now. He could come out and gave a realistic timeframe for the development then I reckon most sane fans would accept that, but he won't.
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Gen.Disorda
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Londoncobbler , Who do you think you are ?
coming round here using logic.
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The 12th Marquis of Sixfields
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I've lost faith in anything the chairman says a long time ago. I've no doubt his motives are good but he doesn't do himself any favours by continuing to tell fans what they want to hear rather than being honest with them. Sure that will be enough to appease some but for a lot he's lost his credibility now. He could come out and gave a realistic timeframe for the development then I reckon most sane fans would accept that, but he won't.
It's been spin, spin, spin ever since we appointed a Head of Media.
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The Hotelend Grand National Sweepstake Champion 2023
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sbedscobb
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London, If seats are so easy to add on, and we all agree they're essential if we're to progress, then why the frig doesn't he do it now that the funds have been gifted to him!
You spew out out the old how many sell outs have we had blah blah.. Reason is We've been cack on and off the pitch for years, due to lack of investment and have never properly promoted the club by introducing all those nice match day facilities despite many asking for a modicum of investment to improve this area, only to be constantly ignored.
Why? Because for 10 years we've been a football club mothballed on the edge of a development project, completely irrelevant in the grand scheme, but promises of a ground to be proud of if we show patients, well we have been and what did we get...
Go have a look at the carbuncle stand with its 100's of restricted views and stilted boxes, which manages after construction give a decrease in seats to the home section!
But nice try at pacifying but my pi55 is boiling at the contempt he has shown Northampton and its football club.
What is it I want? Just a little of what every other club have, a ground fit to attract new support and gain a promotion or two and the ability to sustain any future success. Having just 6500 seats to sell will not do that, so it wont now be happening anytime soon.
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lift tower
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You're right London Cobbler 81. Cardoza has never done anything wrong ever and everything that has ever gone wrong during his tenure is somebody else's fault. Everyone should just shut up and be thankful.
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everbrite
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I like Bungles option 6..
so do I
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2020 Grand National S/S 3rd Place
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The 12th Marquis of Sixfields
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I've suggested a viable alternative. He hands over chairmanship to somebody who knows what they're doing. Unfortunately that ship probably sailed about 8 (at least) years ago.
A new game to play though is "Guess which of the new members is a 'Friend of The Club'"
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The Hotelend Grand National Sweepstake Champion 2023
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Razor
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A new game to play though is "Guess which of the new members is a 'Friend of The Club'"
I might set up a vote. Feel free to merge it with any thread you like.
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