Sack him.

[everbrite]

"Second half of last season".......? Wilder was in charge for the final 20 games and won eight of them, drew seven and lost 5......hardly setting the world alight but did enough...just....to stay up! 4 of those wins came in the last six games, so you could say "don't you remember the last bit of last season" because that was the good bit!!

This season (in all competitions).....9 wins and 13 defeats, only four draws though.

So, 46 games in charge....a full season in league terms..... and more defeats than wins overall. Am I missing something here or is Wilder just the latest in a string of "average managers" we've had?  He has a 37% win record....Boothroyd managed 36%, Sampson had 35% and Gray 33%.

I anticipate a response from Big John Marvo. Woe betide you GPC.

[GrangeParkCobbler]

I anticipate a response from Big John Marvo. Woe betide you GPC.

Marvo likes to deal in facts.......and those are the facts!! 

[DrillingCobbler]

Marvo has also staunchly backed Wilders continued involvement so it will be interesting to hear his latest stance. As it will with Bungle. A man who talks a lot of sense.

He normally posts Sundays so not reactionary. I need his balanced view because I always shoot from the hip. Do we keep him Bungle? I need to know!

[GrangeParkCobbler]

From my figures i'm not advocating sacking him! As we can see we normally get someone who is no better than the previous incumbant! I'd go as far as to say that Calderwood has been the only successful manager of DC's tenure.

So based on "the norm" whats the point of paying someone off his two and a half years remaining and getting someone else in to start the cycle all over again?

[Coolcat]

Funny how you slag Marvo off for talking about the Carr era and that he lives in the past - last time I checked the second half of last season was also in the past - and let's be honest about that particular run - if it had not been for an Oxford self destruct we would already be having this conversation from the conference.

The Oxford 'Self destruct' was almost entirely down to Wilder jumping ship - something most of them hate to admit...so tbf to Wilder, their implosion and our salvation were because not in spite of ole squinty eyes!

[guest2487]

He's gone.

[cobbler150]

Really?

[John]

"Second half of last season".......? Wilder was in charge for the final 20 games and won eight of them, drew seven and lost 5......hardly setting the world alight but did enough...just....to stay up! 4 of those wins came in the last six games, so you could say "don't you remember the last bit of last season" because that was the good bit!!

This season (in all competitions).....9 wins and 13 defeats, only four draws though.

So, 46 games in charge....a full season in league terms..... and more defeats than wins overall. Am I missing something here or is Wilder just the latest in a string of "average managers" we've had?  He has a 37% win record....Boothroyd managed 36%, Sampson had 35% and Gray 33%.

I don't go on win ratio, it's misleading. For example if you had a manager that won 23 games and lost the other 23 games, his win ratio would be 50% and you'd end up with 69 points which maybe would get you in the play-offs. However if you had a manager that won 20, drew 23 and lost 3 you'd be looking at automatic promotion and possibly a Championship yet his win ratio would be worse.

[Montgomery Eypoke III]

"Second half of last season".......? Wilder was in charge for the final 20 games and won eight of them, drew seven and lost 5......hardly setting the world alight but did enough...just....to stay up! 4 of those wins came in the last six games, so you could say "don't you remember the last bit of last season" because that was the good bit!!

This season (in all competitions).....9 wins and 13 defeats, only four draws though.

So, 46 games in charge....a full season in league terms..... and more defeats than wins overall. Am I missing something here or is Wilder just the latest in a string of "average managers" we've had?  He has a 37% win record....Boothroyd managed 36%, Sampson had 35% and Gray 33%.

31 points from 20 games. I make that over a point and a half a game. That's pretty decent form, even without taking into account the fact that he started off with a team already in the bottom two and declining rapidly.

He's a very frustrating bloke. The team selections are driving me up the wall. The results are poor and the whole feeling around the club is pretty grim at the minute. Should we sack him?

If he has "lost the dressing room", and it is sounding as though he may well have done, then yes probably.

If the core of senior pro's are still onside then he needs at least the rest of the season. His priority needs to be a couple of full backs and a holding midfielder in January. He needs to get a settled side and concentrate on shutting the wide open door we currently have at the back.

[Terryfenwickatemyhamster]

If he has "lost the dressing room", and it is sounding as though he may well have done, then yes probably.

Where do you, or anybody else get that from???

[DrillingCobbler]

Where do you, or anybody else get that from???

Dropping his captain is a very big statement. Particularly when he has been one of our best players (best defender) this season.

He's also clearly fallen out with some players (archer, OToole) and his random team selections each week must be frustrating the hell out of most of them.

I will add though that neither the effort levels or ability levels are in my mind the issues we have. The overriding problem is that the team is simply not organised in the slightest, it has very little shape to it...basically we are all over the place. He's been here almost a year and hasn't got the slightest clue as to what his best team is.

[Ralap]

Dropping his captain is a very big statement. Particularly when he has been one of our best players (best defender) this season.

He's also clearly fallen out with some players (archer, OToole) and his random team selections each week must be frustrating the hell out of most of them.

I will add though that neither the effort levels or ability levels are in my mind the issues we have. The overriding problem is that the team is simply not organised in the slightest, it has very little shape to it...basically we are all over the place. He's been here almost a year and hasn't got the slightest clue as to what his best team is.

Driller!!! You've completely fabricated that. Reading between the lines I'd say with the amount of loans we've ended up with again he saw having Duke and Snedker as reason enough to send a so so Archer back releasing a bit of slack on the loans situation. I don't see how it means he fell out with Archer. Just about everyone on this board is in agreement that O'Toole just wasn't working for us. Wilder agreed so he shipped him out, how does that mean he fell out with him?

[DrillingCobbler]

Archer. He's terminated his favourite goal keepers loan early. The goalkeeping position is the most important one in the team and he's gone full circle. Come on mate...those of us with eyes could have told Wilder 3 months ago that he's useless so it's not ability as to why he's gone back!

JJ. He's dicked him around, playing him all over the place...he then finally comes good for us and he sends him to the team we were playing next. He can't get in there now...that's gonna be interesting when his loan finishes!

Of course I am speculating. He may get on great with them but personally I doubt it. What's your views on dropping the captain for someone whose been injured for 4 months?

[Montgomery Eypoke III]

Where do you, or anybody else get that from???

Listen to his interview after last weeks game.

Look at the body language of the players on the pitch last week.

Take into account the comings and goings in the team. Senior pro's left out at the expense of (at times inferior) loanee kids, as mentioned above.

Few whispers of discontent from players, but in fairness they are players being left/ forced out so that is taken with a pinch of salt.

I think there are definitely signs that it might he an issue though. Wouldn't you agree?

[Deepcut Cobbler]

Archer. Agreement that he played if fit. Has now agreed with his club to be returned early because he wasn't performing better than what he had now fit.
Can't see any evidence of losing the dressing room.

[everbrite]

Listen to his interview after last weeks game.

Look at the body language of the players on the pitch last week.

Take into account the comings and goings in the team. Senior pro's left out at the expense of (at times inferior) loanee kids, as mentioned above.

Few whispers of discontent from players, but in fairness they are players being left/ forced out so that is taken with a pinch of salt.

I think there are definitely signs that it might he an issue though. Wouldn't you agree?

I am beginning to think that your interpretation on any give event is flawed by your insistence of tailoring it to suit your argument. quote Mr Saville Row.

[Ralap]

Archer. He's terminated his favourite goal keepers loan early. The goalkeeping position is the most important one in the team and he's gone full circle. Come on mate...those of us with eyes could have told Wilder 3 months ago that he's useless so it's not ability as to why he's gone back!

JJ. He's dicked him around, playing him all over the place...he then finally comes good for us and he sends him to the team we were playing next. He can't get in there now...that's gonna be interesting when his loan finishes!

Of course I am speculating. He may get on great with them but personally I doubt it. What's your views on dropping the captain for someone whose been injured for 4 months?

If there isn't a reason like an injury I wouldn't have dropped Collins but I would have Horwood and Diamond in my back four every week if they are fit. I personally would prefer to see Collins and Diamond as the central defensive pairing. Cresswell has had too many dodgy games for me and there is less than no pace when Diamond and cresswell play together.

You obviously want Wilder out but don't want to say it for some reason, are you after another manager in the ilk of our last three and how do you think the club will finance it with the financial f uck up currently being played out by the Cardozas? Spend the Toney money?

[DrillingCobbler]

I don't mate. I wouldn't sack him, I've said that on a number of threads.

I don't think he's got more than a couple of games left though.

[Terryfenwickatemyhamster]

I'm not for one second pretending I am mates with the players, but I do talk to some of them frequently. There is absolutely no indication that they don't get on with him. In fact they speak really highly of him and often state that they have total faith in him to turn it round. Justifiably or not. Morale seems really good.

Sorry if that disappoints some of you. You'll have to find another angle of attack.

[Montgomery Eypoke III]

I'm not for one second pretending I am mates with the players, but I do talk to some of them frequently. There is absolutely no indication that they don't get on with him. In fact they speak really highly of him and often state that they have total faith in him to turn it round. Justifiably or not. Morale seems really good.

Sorry if that disappoints some of you. You'll have to find another angle of attack.

Actions speak louder than words.