Patience

[Manwork04]

From what I have learnt (Chron) they are apparently not. The repayment schedule seems to be in order! However I would be interested to learn more about your statement.

Read the paper Evers, it was all over the Chronic.

http://www.northamptonchron.co.uk/news/local/council-boss-calls-for-more-detail-on-cobblers-club-sale-and-proposes-early-meeting-1-6815956

[everbrite]

One of the stupidest posts ever posted on Hotel End.
"I dont know enough about business" (I think that's blindingly obvious). Uni Cobbler, eh? If you are the future of this country, then God help us all

JC - I have met this guy who is a genuine supporter; well educated and easy to chat with. I think you slagging him off like that is not a good reflection on you. Give him a chance even if he does not subscribe to your and few others point of view.

[everbrite]

Read the paper Evers, it was all over the Chronic.

http://www.northamptonchron.co.uk/news/local/council-boss-calls-for-more-detail-on-cobblers-club-sale-and-proposes-early-meeting-1-6815956

That was late June and NBC have since met the interested party and called it a "good constructive meeting". Not unreasonable to assume that things appear to be in order - have not heared or learnt anything untoward since that meeting. Hoping that Vintage can clarify the situation?

[Manwork04]

OK I will explain it to you.
The loan is being serviced (payed for) from the loan, because we don't have any new income streams.(exec boxes, hotel and conference centre)
This is obviously not sustainable at circa £60k a week.
This has been going on for over a year when it was drawn down.
Can you now understand why the council are nervous?.

p.s. That's £10m borrowed over 5 year term.

We are heading for the rocks, personally I can't see us making Xmas.

[DrillingCobbler]

Some of the abusive posts on here are plain silly. I will give you an example...

Alistair Slowe said a few weeks ago that 'I WAS ABOUT TO LOOK RATHER STUPID' or words to that effect. 2 weeks later he is on here saying 'deal off'!

Look. Some of you lot claiming to be 'not bothered' etc is rather contrasting with the FACT that you come onto this thread and tell us all thats the case. You are bothered. The only difference being is that you TRUST the regime. Thats fine, lets agree to disagree. VERY Strongly.

Make your point/s and join in the debate. Thats good, its always extremely healthy to have an alternative view point, a government with no opposition is a dictatorship.

This ongoing saga is causing more of a rift as each day passes. Club employees (good ones) have come out of it terribly in recent times due to being forced (I assume that they were) to LIE about the redevelopment (it is a FACT that people were receiving emails saying that work was continuing when AFTER it had been stopped). They may not have even lied intentionally, more a case of passing on the dud information but even so they were providing totally incorrect information to supporter. That really riles me personally.

IF this deal goes pear shaped then the likelihood is that we are screwed. To suggest otherwise is plainly ridiculous given the information we all know, or at least those know that choose to read it.

So as I originally asked to the remaining few of DC's supporters...when do you actually become somebody who wants to see the back of him? How much longer are you prepared to give the man? ANSWER THE QUESTION!

Coming on here every other day or whatever it is just slating those who believe that he is extremely bad news is plain pathetic. I doubt you would be prepared to say who you are either or even what your name is? And I suspect that IF it does all go badly wrong then you will suddenly stop posting/delete your account.

Shane Webster....

[Manwork04]

Top post mate.

[guest170]

Good post drilling.
I come on here to find out what is going on, generally with the rumours and also to find out the identity of Trialist 1 & 2 and i do read the other threads so yes I am interested but I have no concern over the take over nor the development. I am apprehensive about the take over but until we know more I wont get excited either way. Although it would be better to know who they are sooner rather than later
I would also like to point out I made my point and then had a sarcastic comment sent in my direction. You half implied if was the DC supporters who send the abuse and I wanted to address that.
I will 'want to see the back of him' when it directly affects Wilder and his ability to sign the players he wants. I know the Toney issue isn't ideal but A premier league club wants our player, I assume he wants to leave so there is very little we can do. Newcastle have all the power and that would be the same between most league 2 clubs and premier league

[everbrite]

OK I will explain it to you.
The loan is being serviced (payed for) from the loan, because we don't have any new income streams.(exec boxes, hotel and conference centre)
This is obviously not sustainable at circa £60k a week.
This has been going on for over a year when it was drawn down.
Can you now understand why the council are nervous?.

p.s. That's £10m borrowed over 5 year term.

We are heading for the rocks, personally I can't see us making Xmas.

In this instance some of your assertions are based on assumptions! It would indeed be interesting to learn how the loan is being paid but we simply dont know the (all)facts. To the best of my knowledge the Council are not immediately concerned as somehow DC is making the repayments. Anything else is sheer conjecture/rumours. We would know PDQ if NBC were concerned at the current situation as it would surface almost immediately. Can Vintage clarify the situation.

[Coolcat]

There I corrected it for you, the eductation system, eh?

You really are an utter tit...though often called these days, being a troll!
For someone who even in their last few posts (despite being previously made aware) can't differentiate between your and you're...to then try and get one up by correcting an already correct 'realize' just confirms what most on this board I'm sure, think!
As for 'wait and see'...so if the 'consortium' takeover fails to materialize, will another 'wait and see' come galloping over the horizon? zzzz 

[everbrite]

You really are an utter tit...though often called these days, being a troll!
For someone who even in their last few posts (despite being previously made aware) can't differentiate between your and you're...to then try and get one up by correcting an already correct 'realize' just confirms what most on this board I'm sure, think!
As for 'wait and see'...so if the 'consortium' takeover fails to materialize, will another 'wait and see' come galloping over the horizon? zzzz 

You are a fine one to call somebody else a tit and/or troll on here.

[JollyCobbler]

There I corrected it for you, the eductation system, eh?

Oh dear! You've just made yourself look very silly!

[Manwork04]

Oh dear! You've just made yourself look very silly!

Again 

[JollyCobbler]

In this instance some of your assertions are based on assumptions! It would indeed be interesting to learn how the loan is being paid but we simply dont know the (all)facts. To the best of my knowledge the Council are not immediately concerned as somehow DC is making the repayments. Anything else is sheer conjecture/rumours. We would know PDQ if NBC were concerned at the current situation as it would surface almost immediately. Can Vintage clarify the situation.

We really wouldn't. If this all ends badly, think about which administration pushed the loan through and without inserting rigid safeguards. Despite any spin to the contrary, I imagine the current incumbents are down on their knees praying for some saving grace.

[JollyCobbler]

Again 

Yes. Again.

[guest170]

As for 'wait and see'...so if the 'consortium' takeover fails to materialize, will another 'wait and see' come galloping over the horizon? zzzz 

No of course it wont. It is fair to say that those of us who are 'wait and see' do not have a plan B other than DC but I am curious though what your 'Plan B' is? I assume from your message above that as well as looking into the public accounts of a number of business you are also being proactive and contacting other potential buyers? Or is the only plan B to send an 'I told you so' message and another smug smiley?!

At least those that are 'wait and see' have not posted any allegations of corruption and or incompetence at the current chairman nor posted messages questioning the intent of the consortium or questions of corruption based on their nationality. Now I am not saying you have done this Coolcat, there are too many messages on both subjects but it is fair to say all those points have been mentioned on this board over the past few weeks.

[guest2608]

Blimey.... I see name calling from behind the key board is still very much en vogue.
 

[Vintage Cobbler]

Uni - plenty of legitimate questions have been asked by myself and others at the invitation of DC. He has failed to answer any of them and in evading us has made a rod for his own back.  As I and others have pointed out, the burning issue of the payment of a £2.65 million "loan" or "joint venture fee" to David & Tony Cardoza personally is a matter of public record in that it is contained in the first report filed at Companies House by the Administrator of 1st Land Ltd.  There is no reference to it in the second report.  Clearly, the reporting of this payment raises all sorts of questions, legal and ethical, and the longer that there is not a satisfactory reply, if one is possible, the more doubts are going to be sown as to the conduct of those responsible.  There are lots of other issues arising and the whole sorry mess of the redevelopment is likely to threaten the future of our club if the sale does not take place and the new owners do not take over financial responsibility in a proper way.

[guest170]

Uni - plenty of legitimate questions have been asked by myself and others at the invitation of DC. He has failed to answer any of them and in evading us has made a rod for his own back.  As I and others have pointed out, the burning issue of the payment of a £2.65 million "loan" or "joint venture fee" to David & Tony Cardoza personally is a matter of public record in that it is contained in the first report filed at Companies House by the Administrator of 1st Land Ltd.  There is no reference to it in the second report.  Clearly, the reporting of this payment raises all sorts of questions, legal and ethical, and the longer that there is not a satisfactory reply, if one is possible, the more doubts are going to be sown as to the conduct of those responsible.  There are lots of other issues arising and the whole sorry mess of the redevelopment is likely to threaten the future of our club if the sale does not take place and the new owners do not take over financial responsibility in a proper way.

Vintage
I fully agree with everything that you have said. The way that my position differs to some on here is that I do not understand the intricacies of business so I am not going to get worked up by the questions / issues. To answer the original question of this thread, IF anything is proven to be illegal then I will want DC to go. I am not here to say that those questioning what is going on are wrong but I wanted to give my opinion.
I think this thread has become more 'emotional' than it should be by the odd idiotic message from both sides. Essentially in a few weeks (hopefully) we will have more answers and the take over either complete or dead. Although I think both will probably result in more questions than answers again!

[MD]

Having not posted for years, I've just felt the need to re-register having read some of the drivel on here over the last few weeks (including the trust statement which I thought was staggering!). I should balance it by saying that I've also read some very sensible posts from people like Drilling, Manwork and others.

I think we all need to be very realistic... if the takeover fails, and whilst I've obviously not had sight of the accounts, it's hard to see any outcome other than administration. A company cannot legally continue to trade (without an insolvency procedure such as administration being effected) from the moment that it believes (or ought to believe) that there is no likely assurity of being able to pay all future debts as they fall due. At the moment there's no problem doing so as the takeover is providing that potential assurity. If that falls through, we'll be left with a huge interest-bearing debt (plus debt to DC) that, unless I'm missing something, must become very difficult to service given we've seemingly got no return on the capital that's been spent (in fact a 'negative' return since the stand is in a worse state than it was to start with!)

It feels to me that this is DC's one opportunity to cut his losses and get out and recover at least some of his cash (anyone believing the spin that the sale is anything other than 100% for this purpose is naive in the extreme IMHO).

Let's hope the deal is still on the table as, and without wanting to sound like the voice of doom, if this deal falls through and another isn't on the horizon, my guess is that we'll be headed for administration pretty quickly. I can't see any better 'Plan B' for DC that doesn't involve him putting his hands back into the family pockets and, arguably, throwing good money after bad.  Administration allows him to walk away, albeit taking on the chin the significant cash he's already invested (which I doubt he holds much realistic hope of recovering much of anyway), but leaving the council to bear the bulk of the pain. (Loan agreements which I've worked with previously often have a 'change of control' clause to protect the lender, but I've not seen any reference to one in this case)

Like others, I'd love to "wait and see" and focus on the football... I can understand that viewpoint and to some extent I will do so too once the season starts but, personally, I can't just ignore the uncertainty behind the scenes. Let's hope the deal goes through and the new owners make a better job of things than the current regime!

[guest1269]

Uni - plenty of legitimate questions have been asked by myself and others at the invitation of DC. He has failed to answer any of them and in evading us has made a rod for his own back.  As I and others have pointed out, the burning issue of the payment of a £2.65 million "loan" or "joint venture fee" to David & Tony Cardoza personally is a matter of public record in that it is contained in the first report filed at Companies House by the Administrator of 1st Land Ltd.  There is no reference to it in the second report.  Clearly, the reporting of this payment raises all sorts of questions, legal and ethical, and the longer that there is not a satisfactory reply, if one is possible, the more doubts are going to be sown as to the conduct of those responsible.  There are lots of other issues arising and the whole sorry mess of the redevelopment is likely to threaten the future of our club if the sale does not take place and the new owners do not take over financial responsibility in a proper way.

VC - well reasoned response and I cannot argue with any point you make - however as bad as it looks, and as shocking PR as it is, together with the very disrespectful tone taken by DC in not answering questions and saying nothing does not confure guilt nor does it actually confirm any difficulty in paying back the loan. Whilst the £2.65 million "loan" or "joint venture fee" to David & Tony Cardoza is certainly a matter of public record, again there is no evidence for or against the fact that money may be being put to good (honest) financial use - ie to service the loan. Of course we are all pissed because we still see the shambles of the East Stand and with it our hopes of a much better stadium - but lets be realistic the majority of the total loan was never about the football ground - yes we were spun misleading line after line but the reality is football does not typically make money & certainly not at our level or even where we hope to be short term. The loan was never ever going to be serviced by an improved ground - anyone who thinks that is simply wrong.

There is no question in my mind the load was about (non football) development in the main and the football club gets some benefit from the deal - unfortunately the some seems to have diminished to nothing, as has the non football related development.
Now where I certainly agree with you is the risk to the club - but to be honest it's always been there when you have one owner with his money as a "loan" sunk into a limited company - unfortunately that liability is now more than double that before the whole council loan saga - which has to make the take over proposition more risky.

I sincerely hope DC has not screwed up as much as we are speculating because the magnitude of how much he has screwed up is directly proportional to the risk of existance of our club - but just one more time, the degree of how much he has really screwed up is still in the main (from a true financial fact basis) still speculation.