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Fan Ownership

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« Reply #400 on: March 11, 2019, 22:05:56 pm »

Where is he now then?... Is he a Trust member?
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« Reply #401 on: March 11, 2019, 22:22:27 pm »

Where is he now then?... Is he a Trust member?

I believe he is a member, yes. I don't think he is on the Board.
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« Reply #402 on: March 11, 2019, 22:27:45 pm »

The board must have something to do with it. I am sure they tweeted about a link to Norwich to "clear something up" they didn't deny they were responsible them.
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« Reply #403 on: March 11, 2019, 22:36:35 pm »

Board produce document
document roundly ridiculed
Board deny involvement of ridiculed document
 Grin
So none of the board thought "oh , whats that pile of documents and what does it contain"
Sorry trust , massive own goal
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« Reply #404 on: March 11, 2019, 22:43:35 pm »

Serious question to any Trust Board person on here,
How much did you know about the contents of that leaflet, did Meccano seek your approval about its contents, and if he is a non board member, why was he allowed to distribute it prior to the meeting?
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« Reply #405 on: March 11, 2019, 22:56:55 pm »

If that leaflet was approved by the Trust, what on earth were they thinking?
If that leaflet was not approved by the Trust, why did they let it be distributed at their meeting ?
Either way the shambles that has come out of it, hardly bodes well for a group who want to run a professional Football Club.
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« Reply #406 on: March 11, 2019, 23:01:41 pm »

Abraham Anstruther must be spinning in his grave...  Grin

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« Reply #407 on: March 11, 2019, 23:15:46 pm »

Abraham Anstruther must be spinning in his grave...  Grin
How much did you know about the contents of that leaflet, Mr B?


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« Reply #408 on: March 11, 2019, 23:53:44 pm »

How much did you know about the contents of that leaflet, Mr B?




Just enjoyed reading it.. Loved WALOC..
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« Reply #409 on: March 12, 2019, 00:44:46 am »

Could people really not see this coming?  I'd have been more shocked if "Project Proud To Be" had been any good.  What an arrogant, ill-informed, misjudged piece of rubbish.  The few good points it contained are simply drowned by the sea of "know-it-all" claptrap.  I'm sorry but it's soooo bad it's too good not to ridicule.  Someone has had the audacity to read a few online articles and believes they know better than professionals who have devoted their careers to the various subjects.  It's like someone who plays Football Manager and applies for the England job.

What was Meccano's quote the other month.  Something like the most in depth study of the club in it's history.  Identifying macro level issues.  Making it up as they go along.  What people at the club got interviewed to find out what they do?  How many coaches did you speak to?  What knowledge of the current practices do you have and how did you obtain that information?

In fact here's some easy ones for anyone involved to answer.  Who wrote it?  Who else contributed?  Provide an appendix listing your source matter and finally state what experience those involved in the writing of it bring.

As it's a living breathing document let's add some more sections.

GROUND IMPROVEMENTS

Problem - Not enough people behind the bar.....Solution - get more people behind the bar
Problem - Burgers are too expensive.....Solution - Sell cheaper burgers
Problem - The East Stand isn't finished.....Solution - Finish the East Stand

In fact this document has proven life changing for me on a personal level.  This morning I ran out of toothpaste.  Left me stumped what to do.....then I thought what would Project Proud To Be suggest?  Yep, buy more toothpaste!  It's that simple.  Late for work....leave earlier.  Hungry...eat something.  Thirsty....have a drink.  Thank you Project Proud To Be.

So the Trust board didn't see this.  YEAH RIGHT!!!  Andy Roberts spoke in interviews about some of the topics it contained.  People can back track all they like.  Everyone knew this was part of the event and if you didn't you are either lying or incompetent.

I note none of the usual suspects have appeared yet to even attempt to offer a defence.  Open and Honest remember the mantra.

So apart from that disaster let's talk community/fan ownership.  On the plus side fabulous to get an Exeter perspective represented warts and all.  No better experience and example of the challenges we would face.

Here are the problems though.  We've come up with a hybrid model.  Ask yourself why?  It's obvious, fan ownership alone simply cannot afford to buy and finance the club.  So let's get local business involved.

Ask yourself this though.  What's in it for them?  Does being local make a business man suitable to put our Trust in?  Who decides whether that businessman is fit and proper and when do the membership get consulted.  Bear in mind they admitted they approached the club already with a backer.  Who was that backer and what was their motivation?  Convenient to claim commercial sensitivities to avoid answering tough/any questions.  The irony of being secretive and not letting you the members share this information.  This from people that in the next sentence slaughter the current ownership for not disclosing development information.

Next the idea that somehow a community ownership would be better placed to get a development moving.  Well for starters you don't have the immediate finance and secondly you will face all the same council planning delays everyone else does.  Explain to me what you skills and expertise you possess that everyone else is missing.

It's the lunatics taking over the asylum.  Community ownership is a sure fire way of guaranteeing we stand still AT BEST and it costs you personally more money just to do so.  But you will all be happier apparently as we get to have a say....except you don't.....the lunatics in charge will do and share what they deem fit.

Finally the club for sale price.  I assume if the Trust got the club for a quid they will sell it for a quid when the inevitable time comes to seek the investment required to progress to the next level?
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« Reply #410 on: March 12, 2019, 07:13:35 am »

Fan ownership is a route to explore BUT personally I believe the best route is to get a group of investors together (hopefully with local interest) to raise the kind of money to buy the club AND more importantly to invest and run the club in the future!

The Trust could be involved, as a vehicle to represent fans who wish to invest to a smaller extent, but I would be surprised if this would involve more than 10 to 20% of the money required now and in the future.
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« Reply #411 on: March 12, 2019, 07:51:48 am »

Fan ownership is a route to explore BUT personally I believe the best route is to get a group of investors together (hopefully with local interest) to raise the kind of money to buy the club AND more importantly to invest and run the club in the future!

The Trust could be involved, as a vehicle to represent fans who wish to invest to a smaller extent, but I would be surprised if this would involve more than 10 to 20% of the money required now and in the future.

Yeah, but after this shambles, if we were taking that approach who'd be prepared to contribute any money in the form of smaller investments if it meant having to trust the Trust (no pun intended) on what they were going to do with it? On current form they'd go out to buy a football club and come back with some magic beans!

Great post, MCHammer, by the way.  Grin
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« Reply #412 on: March 12, 2019, 08:03:17 am »

As has been stated previously, the Trust would appoint somebody with the relevant experience to oversee the group of smaller investors (ie fans).
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« Reply #413 on: March 12, 2019, 08:17:33 am »

For those who were not at the meeting and are interested in a balanced report of Sunday’s meeting I suggest that you read the report on the Trust’s FaceBook page.

I was there as a Trust member. I thought it was very well hosted by Andy Roberts & Kevin Simons on behalf of the Trust and was a very interesting afternoon.  Time well spent.  A lot of hard work goes into arranging an event like this.  Whether you are for or against community ownership have the courtesy to respect the effort and commitment of those involved. 

Far too many of you making comments were not there and one who was mouthing off about him having better things to do on a Sunday afternoon like mending his rabbit hutch rushed to his keyboard later that day anxiously wanting a report.  Pathetic.

Some of the comments on here about Tom Reed are absolutely objectionable including those made by Drilling who as a Trust director should learn to act like one and in a more disciplined & professional manner.  I guess from his tweet on Saturday night that he was too busy on his settee to read any paperwork.  Tom Reed as we all know is very much an advocate of community ownership and the return of safe terracing.  Prior to Sunday’s meeting he took the time and trouble to visit Exeter and see first hand what has been achieved by this 100% fan owned club.  Many could learn more from him about this and how it works before taking random pot shots at him from the safe distance of their keyboards.

Getting back to the main subject as Hamster has commented the lead speaker from Exeter did say that 100% supporter ownership had a ceiling in his view pointing out that crazy money in being spent in the Championship by reckless owners who are engaged in a **** to reach the riches of the Premier League. He did say that Exeter has a policy of being debt free and so although there may be lean years on the pitch the club will not be put at financial risk by incurring debt it cannot repay.  It was also clear that the 100% model requires a lot of effort and commitment on the part of volunteer fans. 

There was no speaker from a club with a hybrid model. Roy Crutchley of Phipps Brewery said that he thought that there were plenty of businesses in Northampton who would be willing to invest in a venture involving community ownership.  This concept to my mind now needs to be worked on by the Trust directors. I think it holds the best prospects for us.

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« Reply #414 on: March 12, 2019, 08:37:59 am »

For those who were not at the meeting and are interested in a balanced report of Sunday’s meeting I suggest that you read the report on the Trust’s FaceBook page.


Can it be posted on the Trusts Website with a link on here for those not on Facebook?
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« Reply #415 on: March 12, 2019, 09:02:09 am »


Far too many of you making comments were not there and one who was mouthing off about him having better things to do on a Sunday afternoon like mending his rabbit hutch rushed to his keyboard later that day anxiously wanting a report.  Pathetic.


That was me!  That was me!

To be clear, I would consider any activity more important than attending this meeting. My non-attendance was rather the point. It had the potential to be dangerous and damaging to our football club and the fewer people that showed an interest the better. That's why I pointedly used the rabbit hutch repair as something trivial that I found more important (plus that's really what I was doing!).

I think you may have misread the tone in my eagerness for a meeting report! I did later say that I'd be interested in hearing how it panned out, but I was thinking more about how many were there, did the club send representation etc.

As for your defence of Tom/MeccanoStand- yes, he's keen and done some research. Good for him. He's also come up with a right load of nonsense on the back of it. A colleague of mine watches lots of medical documentaries as says she'd love to do an operation on someone. Her enthusiasm doesn't replace the medical training that would make her capable of doing one though!
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« Reply #416 on: March 12, 2019, 09:20:04 am »

Could people really not see this coming?  I'd have been more shocked if "Project Proud To Be" had been any good.  What an arrogant, ill-informed, misjudged piece of rubbish.  The few good points it contained are simply drowned by the sea of "know-it-all" claptrap.  I'm sorry but it's soooo bad it's too good not to ridicule.  Someone has had the audacity to read a few online articles and believes they know better than professionals who have devoted their careers to the various subjects.  It's like someone who plays Football Manager and applies for the England job.

What was Meccano's quote the other month.  Something like the most in depth study of the club in it's history.  Identifying macro level issues.  Making it up as they go along.  What people at the club got interviewed to find out what they do?  How many coaches did you speak to?  What knowledge of the current practices do you have and how did you obtain that information?

In fact here's some easy ones for anyone involved to answer.  Who wrote it?  Who else contributed?  Provide an appendix listing your source matter and finally state what experience those involved in the writing of it bring.

As it's a living breathing document let's add some more sections.

GROUND IMPROVEMENTS

Problem - Not enough people behind the bar.....Solution - get more people behind the bar
Problem - Burgers are too expensive.....Solution - Sell cheaper burgers
Problem - The East Stand isn't finished.....Solution - Finish the East Stand

In fact this document has proven life changing for me on a personal level.  This morning I ran out of toothpaste.  Left me stumped what to do.....then I thought what would Project Proud To Be suggest?  Yep, buy more toothpaste!  It's that simple.  Late for work....leave earlier.  Hungry...eat something.  Thirsty....have a drink.  Thank you Project Proud To Be.

So the Trust board didn't see this.  YEAH RIGHT!!!  Andy Roberts spoke in interviews about some of the topics it contained.  People can back track all they like.  Everyone knew this was part of the event and if you didn't you are either lying or incompetent.

I note none of the usual suspects have appeared yet to even attempt to offer a defence.  Open and Honest remember the mantra.

So apart from that disaster let's talk community/fan ownership.  On the plus side fabulous to get an Exeter perspective represented warts and all.  No better experience and example of the challenges we would face.

Here are the problems though.  We've come up with a hybrid model.  Ask yourself why?  It's obvious, fan ownership alone simply cannot afford to buy and finance the club.  So let's get local business involved.

Ask yourself this though.  What's in it for them?  Does being local make a business man suitable to put our Trust in?  Who decides whether that businessman is fit and proper and when do the membership get consulted.  Bear in mind they admitted they approached the club already with a backer.  Who was that backer and what was their motivation?  Convenient to claim commercial sensitivities to avoid answering tough/any questions.  The irony of being secretive and not letting you the members share this information.  This from people that in the next sentence slaughter the current ownership for not disclosing development information.

Next the idea that somehow a community ownership would be better placed to get a development moving.  Well for starters you don't have the immediate finance and secondly you will face all the same council planning delays everyone else does.  Explain to me what you skills and expertise you possess that everyone else is missing.

It's the lunatics taking over the asylum.  Community ownership is a sure fire way of guaranteeing we stand still AT BEST and it costs you personally more money just to do so.  But you will all be happier apparently as we get to have a say....except you don't.....the lunatics in charge will do and share what they deem fit.

Finally the club for sale price.  I assume if the Trust got the club for a quid they will sell it for a quid when the inevitable time comes to seek the investment required to progress to the next level?

Good post. Difficult to argue with much of that.
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« Reply #417 on: March 12, 2019, 09:29:45 am »

Good post by MC but Vintage has already challenged it - it’s a case of this is my truth tell me yours.
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guest2677
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« Reply #418 on: March 12, 2019, 10:11:56 am »

Can it be posted on the Trusts Website with a link on here for those not on Facebook?
Absolutely where it should be. Couldn't agree more.
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« Reply #419 on: March 12, 2019, 10:42:05 am »

The document that was circulated yesterday was not seen by the Trust Board. As a trust board member, the first I knew of it was when I went on to twitter yesterday evening.

From my prospective, its a huge embarrassment. I actually quite like a formation which includes wing backs   Wink

In all seriousness though; it shouldn't have been distributed with the Trusts name on it and I hope that the person responsible for putting it together confirms that very soon.

I dont mean this to sound like an attack on you but the Trust are asking us to 'keep an open mind' with regards to Trust / Fan ownership and at the very first meeting, the document that was used to promote the meeting on Twitter has not been seen / signed off by the board!! Yes in the grand scheme this is fairly trivial but its an embarrassing start when you are talking about running an entire football club and yet you dont know what is being presented to 200 people at the launch. I also saw comments from the Trust about its not a proposal but a 'placeholder'. WTF is a placeholder?!
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