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Summer Transfer Rumours 2019

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Author Topic: Summer Transfer Rumours 2019  (Read 136586 times)
lordjord
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« Reply #1540 on: August 01, 2019, 15:11:16 pm »

Stats tend to mean that someone is less biased surely because they are basing their opinions on fact?

I thought Cornell did ok last season to be honest. However the stats disagree with me. Im sure you have heard of XG (expected goals scored) well there is a similar stat for goals conceded (XGC). XGC is based on shots on target only, so it is a good measurement of shot stopping.

Of the 24 keepers who conceded the most goals in league 2 last season Cornell had the 4th worst goals conceded compared to his XGC. 62 goals went in, his XGC figure was 55.55, so he was -6.45 goals. Only Murphy (Bury), Fitzsimons (Notts County) and Forde (Cambridge) had worse figures.

I like Cornell and dont understand the over the top dislike of him from some, however if we were to receive a fee for him I would say that is good business and lets move on.
« Last Edit: August 01, 2019, 15:15:49 pm by lordjord » Report Spam   Logged
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« Reply #1541 on: August 01, 2019, 15:26:00 pm »

Stats tend to mean that someone is less biased surely because they are basing their opinions on fact?

I thought Cornell did ok last season to be honest. However the stats disagree with me. Im sure you have heard of XG (expected goals scored) well there is a similar stat for goals conceded (XGC). XGC is based on shots on target only, so it is a good measurement of shot stopping.

Of the 24 keepers who conceded the most goals in league 2 last season Cornell had the 4th worst goals conceded compared to his XGC. 62 goals went in, his XGC figure was 55.55, so he was -6.45 goals. Only Murphy (Bury), Fitzsimons (Notts County) and Forde (Cambridge) had worse figures.

I like Cornell and dont understand the over the top dislike of him from some, however if we were to receive a fee for him I would say that is good business and lets move on.

Very easy to agree with you especially if we get a fee? I too dislike the almost pathological dislike from at least two 'supporters'! However as more than or two have pointed out our defence last season was not the brightest.
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ClarenceInDefence
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« Reply #1542 on: August 01, 2019, 15:32:28 pm »

Another one sided opinion from you? See Victoria on Twitter is a fan of Dai Treat her with caution.

Hmmm. These stats simply show that the people who thought Cornell was not good enough last season, based on what they saw with their own eyes, weren't too far wide of the mark, to say the least. Good to know Dai has another fan in Victoria though.  Grin
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« Reply #1543 on: August 01, 2019, 15:54:17 pm »

Stats tend to mean that someone is less biased surely because they are basing their opinions on fact?

I thought Cornell did ok last season to be honest. However the stats disagree with me. Im sure you have heard of XG (expected goals scored) well there is a similar stat for goals conceded (XGC). XGC is based on shots on target only, so it is a good measurement of shot stopping.

Of the 24 keepers who conceded the most goals in league 2 last season Cornell had the 4th worst goals conceded compared to his XGC. 62 goals went in, his XGC figure was 55.55, so he was -6.45 goals. Only Murphy (Bury), Fitzsimons (Notts County) and Forde (Cambridge) had worse figures.

I like Cornell and dont understand the over the top dislike of him from some, however if we were to receive a fee for him I would say that is good business and lets move on.

Exactly. I would also argue that conversely it's a better guide to the performance of a teams defence than goals conceded.

The teams with the best record for shots on target against last season were:

Colchester 154
Mansfield 165
Exeter 167
Bury 172
Tranmere 175
Port Vale 178
Cobblers 179
Lincoln 186
Newport 187
Stevenage 188
FGR 190
MK 194

I thought Taylor and Buchanan in particular were poor last year and I'm glad they have now left, but the stats show that the goal was protected a little better by the defence than many might think.
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mr3teas
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« Reply #1544 on: August 01, 2019, 15:55:17 pm »

Good shot stopper but distribution and positioning poor
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« Reply #1545 on: August 01, 2019, 17:36:22 pm »

To put a slightly different slant on this interesting discussion surrounding shot stats, it did appear that virtually all of the goals we conceded were just plain stupid ones! More so than any other seasons, or at least it seemed like that!

How many goals did opponents score against us, where you could honestly say 'bloody good goal that'!

We seemed to always have lapses in concentration, particularly set pieces. I think our general defensive play on the whole was decent but individual errors were very much higher than average. So that meant that when a team had a chance to shoot, it was normally a straight forward easy goal where Cornell had zero chance of saving it.

Since KC was appointed, there was only a couple of games when we rolled over, but we didn't have the ability to grind out results. One of the most frustrating seasons in memory, one where we should have done so much better than we did!
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« Reply #1546 on: August 01, 2019, 18:24:59 pm »

Exactly. I would also argue that conversely it's a better guide to the performance of a teams defence than goals conceded.

The teams with the best record for shots on target against last season were:

Colchester 154
Mansfield 165
Exeter 167
Bury 172
Tranmere 175
Port Vale 178
Cobblers 179
Lincoln 186
Newport 187
Stevenage 188
FGR 190
MK 194

I thought Taylor and Buchanan in particular were poor last year and I'm glad they have now left, but the stats show that the goal was protected a little better by the defence than many might think.

I don’t agree with your last sentence. An example of this was the FA winning goal scored by Lincoln which was caused by the defence backing off to the extent ‘it was after you’ Charles.  If you are going to present stats in a way to incriminate a player then you might give us the common courtesy of some mitigating circumstances like our porous defence. Above all it will give some credence to your fact finding stats. Needless to say most XG & XGC goals would be by definition somewhat subjective. Yet you sneer and laugh at a championship manager who is apparently prepared to pay money for Cornell. Who am I to believe you with your fair minded  Roll Eyes stats or a manager/coach who has watched Cornell play; my money is on the manager or coach who is more likely to be an expert.
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Dan
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« Reply #1547 on: August 01, 2019, 18:48:17 pm »

I just find it incredible that a player who is so average has caused so much debate for so long  Grin Fair play to him for achieving this.
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« Reply #1548 on: August 01, 2019, 19:06:36 pm »


 Yet you sneer and laugh at a championship manager who is apparently prepared to pay money for Cornell. Who am I to believe you with your fair minded  Roll Eyes stats or a manager/coach who has watched Cornell play; my money is on the manager or coach who is more likely to be an expert.

We don't yet know if a manager is prepared to pay money for Cornell, if so, if he's an expert, does that mean that the managers at all his previous clubs were experts as well? because all of them released him.
    Good luck to him if he get's a move to the Championship, but I'm not holding my breath.
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« Reply #1549 on: August 01, 2019, 19:26:12 pm »

We don't yet know if a manager is prepared to pay money for Cornell, if so, if he's an expert, does that mean that the managers at all his previous clubs were experts as well? because all of them released him.
    Good luck to him if he get's a move to the Championship, but I'm not holding my breath.

No doubt quite a few on here will inform you of players released and who went onto better things. Vardy maybe an example.
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« Reply #1550 on: August 01, 2019, 22:30:27 pm »

No doubt quite a few on here will inform you of players released and who went onto better things. Vardy maybe an example.

Good use of "maybe" as i dont think he was ever released as a senior player?!
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barton cobbler
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« Reply #1551 on: August 01, 2019, 23:55:25 pm »

Good use of "maybe" as i dont think he was ever released as a senior player?!
He was released by both Swansea and Oldham. his only contracts apart from loans.
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« Reply #1552 on: August 02, 2019, 00:05:30 am »

Cornell to Reading?

 Grin Grin Grin Proper bullsh1t
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« Reply #1553 on: August 02, 2019, 06:55:31 am »

He was released by both Swansea and Oldham. his only contracts apart from loans.

Good point Barton
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ClarenceInDefence
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« Reply #1554 on: August 02, 2019, 09:32:48 am »


I don’t agree with your last sentence. An example of this was the FA winning goal scored by Lincoln which was caused by the defence backing off to the extent ‘it was after you’ Charles.  If you are going to present stats in a way to incriminate a player then you might give us the common courtesy of some mitigating circumstances like our porous defence. Above all it will give some credence to your fact finding stats. Needless to say most XG & XGC goals would be by definition somewhat subjective. Yet you sneer and laugh at a championship manager who is apparently prepared to pay money for Cornell. Who am I to believe you with your fair minded  Roll Eyes stats or a manager/coach who has watched Cornell play; my money is on the manager or coach who is more likely to be an expert.


I didn't say the defence was never at fault for any goals, but that over the course of the season the stats show that the goal was better protected by the defence than it was by 17 other teams. I didn't mention 'mitigating circumstances like our porous defence' - this is what my post was about Evers, the stats actually show the defence wasn't anywhere near as 'porous' as what the goals against column would suggest.
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« Reply #1555 on: August 02, 2019, 11:22:27 am »

I didn't say the defence was never at fault for any goals, but that over the course of the season the stats show that the goal was better protected by the defence than it was by 17 other teams. I didn't mention 'mitigating circumstances like our porous defence' - this is what my post was about Evers, the stats actually show the defence wasn't anywhere near as 'porous' as what the goals against column would suggest.

I think stats are great to have and a necessary tool for any Football manager. Your stats or at least those which you basically manipulate to suit your personal views on Cornell are by their very nature often entirely subjective and used by pundits to illustrate their POV. Unlike you I saw enough of Cornell to realize he was a relatively modest keeper; by no means the best in the Division (2). Unfortunately for you the current Manager played him 46 times last season which at least shows he commanded the respect of KC. Furthermore the Players voted Cornell their player of the season; so you rubbish KC's judgement and his team mates for voting for him. Could have easily been Pierre. You also make the cardinal error of relying on video's which often give very little back ground to most goals scored. Drilling is quite right to point out that many of the goals against(us) were caused by lack of concentration and poor ball retention in our defensive third (or worse in midfield). At least 50% of those on here do not agree with you  and certainly the silent majority say he is ok for the task in hand. If you are going to debate a players ability always produce a few positives to give your subject more credence.
As an after thought on the two currnet keepers both look reasonably competent and would not be surprised if the ex Shrews guy gets the nod; especially if Cornell has been the subject of Transfer interest. If he did sign for a Chamionship side you would rubbish that because thats not on your agenda.
Some Managers are able to pick out decent players where the stats are not apparently in the players favour.
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« Reply #1556 on: August 02, 2019, 12:45:24 pm »

This. He’s not very good. If we are happy for another bottom half season, then by all means keep him as number one. If we want a promotion challenge, we need much better. For a start, the amount of goals he let in from range this year has been far too high.

I said this about Cornell on the 11th May in the Post Mortem thread. I maintain this. I personally think he will start tomorrow so hope to be wrong on my overall forecast.

If he plays though, he will have my support as he will have earnt it, due to actually having competent competition.
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« Reply #1557 on: August 02, 2019, 13:04:47 pm »

Cornell deserves to start tomorrow . He looks the better of the two keepers .
Meanwhile , KC has made it clear he sees Bunney as a wing back or as part of a back three but would rather move him on . Notably , he didn’t mention playing him in an advanced role .
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« Reply #1558 on: August 02, 2019, 13:06:59 pm »

I said this about Cornell on the 11th May in the Post Mortem thread. I maintain this. I personally think he will start tomorrow so hope to be wrong on my overall forecast.

If he plays though, he will have my support as he will have earnt it, due to actually having competent competition.

I think it will be the ex Shrews guy - looked ok in games I have seen this season. There is not a lot if any to chose between them. We do need a good class keeper; until the season starts wont be able to comment on either of them.
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« Reply #1559 on: August 02, 2019, 13:11:52 pm »

I think it will be the ex Shrews guy - looked ok in games I have seen this season. There is not a lot if any to chose between them. We do need a good class keeper; until the season starts wont be able to comment on either of them.

Wrong Quote - reply Re bunney

I read it as KC is happy for him to stay, but the player himself wants to move up north and so far no offers.
But sounds to me as though he has come back and got his head down and worked hard for KC
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