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Bums firmly on seats: Brady's creative void

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bungle
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« on: October 02, 2021, 17:33:27 pm »

The primary reason for our relegation last year was a lack of goals.

The strikers (Edmondson, Rose) received a lot of criticism, but the fact
is we simply didn't create enough chances for them. Most of the fanbase
accepted that Brady's hands were tied due to Curle's poor recruitment and looked
forward to what he could do when he brought his own squad in.

In the summer, Brady promised 'bums-off-seats' football. He said we'd
go with two up front and play a more expansive attacking game.

Well, we are now 10 games into the season and by my count we have scored a grand total of 3 league goals from open play (the other 6 being exclusively from corners, free kicks and long-throw ins). We have just failed to register a single shot on target against Sutton United at home.

Up until now our defensive competence has enabled us to grind out results and has papered over the cracks of the creative void at the heart of the team. However, with Guthrie out today and the normally imperious defence severely rattled by a physical Sutton side, the complete lack of attacking threat at the other end was all too evident.

So why has this creative void persisted over two seasons under Brady? IMO, it's far too simplistic to blame the strikers as individuals - it's much deeper and more tactically systemic than that. If they were missing bags of chances then I would be the first to criticise them, but the service simply isn't there. Harry Smith has gone from being a goal-shy no hoper with us to emerging as the 6-goal L2 top scorer at Orient, who have hit 18 goals this year, double our haul: clearly a bit of decent service has done wonders for his confidence.

For me, we're not creating chances because we are too cautious, too predictable and too static. We play a tired old 4-4-2 with Hoskins shoehorned in as a winger who works hard but creates little in terms of crosses or assists. None of the first choice central midfielders have the capacity to drive forward with the ball and commit men and again, none of them have any assists as yet. No one goes 'between the lines'. The only sign of any kind of spark or combination play is the partnership between Koiki and Pinnock on the left, but the lack of any corresponding threat on the right makes us lopsided.
As many have said, it all smacks of Calderwood circa 2003, but without the league-crushing budgetary advantage which eventually led to our promotion.

I'm really tired of this safety first bulls***. It's got the stage where I'd rather see Brady play Pollock in centre mid and lose 4-3 than watch us play another game of sterile chanceless nothingball.

I've said many times that if Brady is really serious about delivering 'bums of seat football' and developing us beyond a mid table basement side then he has to seriously consider ditching 4-4-2 and going with something less predictable. 4-3-3 is out because our forwards don't have the pace or guile to play wide; 3 at the back should probably be resisted because the back 4 have been excellent as a unit. IMO as I've said many times, 4-2-3-1 is the formation which best suits our admittedly limited squad. Our strikers are contributing very little at the moment and it's time to sacrifice one to bring in another creative midfielder:

                                   Roberts

               MacGowan Guthrie Horsfall Koiki

                         McWilliams   Sowerby/Lewis

                      Pinnock     Pollock      Connolly/Hoskins

                                     Etete

I find it hard to believe that this side would do worse than the shower of **** we saw today. What has Brady got to lose? It's not as if we're going to end up creating fewer chances is it?





 




 











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« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2021, 17:44:17 pm »

His job!
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« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2021, 17:55:28 pm »

Spot on Bungle
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Terryfenwickatemyhamster
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« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2021, 17:58:24 pm »

Excellent post. But whenís the last time any manager looked past his favourite system.
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« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2021, 19:04:57 pm »

The primary reason for our relegation last year was a lack of goals.

The strikers (Edmondson, Rose) received a lot of criticism, but the fact
is we simply didn't create enough chances for them. Most of the fanbase
accepted that Brady's hands were tied due to Curle's poor recruitment and looked
forward to what he could do when he brought his own squad in.

In the summer, Brady promised 'bums-off-seats' football. He said we'd
go with two up front and play a more expansive attacking game.

Well, we are now 10 games into the season and by my count we have scored a grand total of 3 league goals from open play (the other 6 being exclusively from corners, free kicks and long-throw ins). We have just failed to register a single shot on target against Sutton United at home.

Up until now our defensive competence has enabled us to grind out results and has papered over the cracks of the creative void at the heart of the team. However, with Guthrie out today and the normally imperious defence severely rattled by a physical Sutton side, the complete lack of attacking threat at the other end was all too evident.

So why has this creative void persisted over two seasons under Brady? IMO, it's far too simplistic to blame the strikers as individuals - it's much deeper and more tactically systemic than that. If they were missing bags of chances then I would be the first to criticise them, but the service simply isn't there. Harry Smith has gone from being a goal-shy no hoper with us to emerging as the 6-goal L2 top scorer at Orient, who have hit 18 goals this year, double our haul: clearly a bit of decent service has done wonders for his confidence.

For me, we're not creating chances because we are too cautious, too predictable and too static. We play a tired old 4-4-2 with Hoskins shoehorned in as a winger who works hard but creates little in terms of crosses or assists. None of the first choice central midfielders have the capacity to drive forward with the ball and commit men and again, none of them have any assists as yet. No one goes 'between the lines'. The only sign of any kind of spark or combination play is the partnership between Koiki and Pinnock on the left, but the lack of any corresponding threat on the right makes us lopsided.
As many have said, it all smacks of Calderwood circa 2003, but without the league-crushing budgetary advantage which eventually led to our promotion.

I'm really tired of this safety first bulls***. It's got the stage where I'd rather see Brady play Pollock in centre mid and lose 4-3 than watch us play another game of sterile chanceless nothingball.

I've said many times that if Brady is really serious about delivering 'bums of seat football' and developing us beyond a mid table basement side then he has to seriously consider ditching 4-4-2 and going with something less predictable. 4-3-3 is out because our forwards don't have the pace or guile to play wide; 3 at the back should probably be resisted because the back 4 have been excellent as a unit. IMO as I've said many times, 4-2-3-1 is the formation which best suits our admittedly limited squad. Our strikers are contributing very little at the moment and it's time to sacrifice one to bring in another creative midfielder:

                                   Roberts

               MacGowan Guthrie Horsfall Koiki

                         McWilliams   Sowerby/Lewis

                      Pinnock     Pollock      Connolly/Hoskins

                                     Etete

I find it hard to believe that this side would do worse than the shower of **** we saw today. What has Brady got to lose? It's not as if we're going to end up creating fewer chances is


The problem is that after that display its not the system we play its the individual overall performance by the players. Some were truly hopeless today! Aside from that the team selection looked pretty clueless as well. Another poor performance like that will ensure JB will end up on the ropes.
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« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2021, 19:24:27 pm »

The passing football went right out of the window today.
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« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2021, 19:29:03 pm »

The problem is that after that display its not the system we play its the individual overall performance by the players. Some were truly hopeless today!
You're right, this is something which is often overlooked in the desire to find a solution to an abject performance like that. None of our players seemed capable of realising let alone responding when our longball aimless hoof didn't work today, and as the pundit on radio post game said that shouldn't require a prompt or instruction from the touchline at this level.
You can fiddle with formations and shuffle our limited pack as much as you like but if the players play without desire or confidence it isn't changing anything.
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« Reply #7 on: October 02, 2021, 19:43:17 pm »

Excellent post Bungle.
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« Reply #8 on: October 02, 2021, 20:16:46 pm »

I agree Bungle it's time to try a different formation.
4-4-2 is said to be a simple system that's easy for lower league players to understand. It relies on working the ball wide and delivering crosses for the strikers. We just don't do that. Our two central midfielders get out numbered so I would pick an extra man in midfield instead of a striker.
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« Reply #9 on: October 02, 2021, 20:44:43 pm »

Maybe Brady is just Curle in disguise and will refuse to change his mind, even when his P45 is being waved under his nose.
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bungle
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« Reply #10 on: October 02, 2021, 21:00:33 pm »

None of our players seemed capable of realising let alone responding when our longball aimless hoof didn't work today, and as the pundit on radio post game said that shouldn't require a prompt or instruction from the touchline at this level.
You can fiddle with formations and shuffle our limited pack as much as you like but if the players play without desire or confidence it isn't changing anything.


I'd argue that the reason they were resorting to 'longball aimless hoof' is that they didn't have the confidence to play it short into the midfield. Why is that? Perhaps because they don't trust the midfielders to keep possession. Perhaps because the midfielders don't want to show for the ball because when they get it there isn't enough movement ahead of them between the lines or on the overlap. We have an overly static and predictable system and there is a failure to rehearse patterns of play. Pumping it forward to Kabamba is the easy option for defenders to take because they know that a loss of possession in the opponents final third will be less catastrophic. The result: sterile risk adverse football.

You seem to echo Brady's claim that Sutton simply 'wanted it more', but I'm not really buying that. Tactical coherence breeds confidence at this level. Sutton have a very simple system and have the personnel (proper target man etc) to make it work. In contrast, we have no clear identity as an attacking force: we're neither a proper long ball team nor a possession-based passing team. We play 4-4-2 but with only one supposedly natural winger. No wonder the players are confused and lack confidence going forward. The one huge source of confidence which we do have is our excellent defence. However, the Rochdale and Sutton games suggest that when you take one of the first choice CBs out, then that confidence is threatened.



 


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« Reply #11 on: October 02, 2021, 21:23:11 pm »

I think too much faith was put in Martin Foyle.

We came into the season putting all our eggs in his basket with Scottish league players JB or CC had never seen before.

Turns out the majority arenít league 2 standard.
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« Reply #12 on: October 02, 2021, 21:27:24 pm »

The primary reason for our relegation last year was a lack of goals.

The strikers (Edmondson, Rose) received a lot of criticism, but the fact
is we simply didn't create enough chances for them. Most of the fanbase
accepted that Brady's hands were tied due to Curle's poor recruitment and looked
forward to what he could do when he brought his own squad in.

In the summer, Brady promised 'bums-off-seats' football. He said we'd
go with two up front and play a more expansive attacking game.

Well, we are now 10 games into the season and by my count we have scored a grand total of 3 league goals from open play (the other 6 being exclusively from corners, free kicks and long-throw ins). We have just failed to register a single shot on target against Sutton United at home.

Up until now our defensive competence has enabled us to grind out results and has papered over the cracks of the creative void at the heart of the team. However, with Guthrie out today and the normally imperious defence severely rattled by a physical Sutton side, the complete lack of attacking threat at the other end was all too evident.

So why has this creative void persisted over two seasons under Brady? IMO, it's far too simplistic to blame the strikers as individuals - it's much deeper and more tactically systemic than that. If they were missing bags of chances then I would be the first to criticise them, but the service simply isn't there. Harry Smith has gone from being a goal-shy no hoper with us to emerging as the 6-goal L2 top scorer at Orient, who have hit 18 goals this year, double our haul: clearly a bit of decent service has done wonders for his confidence.

For me, we're not creating chances because we are too cautious, too predictable and too static. We play a tired old 4-4-2 with Hoskins shoehorned in as a winger who works hard but creates little in terms of crosses or assists. None of the first choice central midfielders have the capacity to drive forward with the ball and commit men and again, none of them have any assists as yet. No one goes 'between the lines'. The only sign of any kind of spark or combination play is the partnership between Koiki and Pinnock on the left, but the lack of any corresponding threat on the right makes us lopsided.
As many have said, it all smacks of Calderwood circa 2003, but without the league-crushing budgetary advantage which eventually led to our promotion.

I'm really tired of this safety first bulls***. It's got the stage where I'd rather see Brady play Pollock in centre mid and lose 4-3 than watch us play another game of sterile chanceless nothingball.

I've said many times that if Brady is really serious about delivering 'bums of seat football' and developing us beyond a mid table basement side then he has to seriously consider ditching 4-4-2 and going with something less predictable. 4-3-3 is out because our forwards don't have the pace or guile to play wide; 3 at the back should probably be resisted because the back 4 have been excellent as a unit. IMO as I've said many times, 4-2-3-1 is the formation which best suits our admittedly limited squad. Our strikers are contributing very little at the moment and it's time to sacrifice one to bring in another creative midfielder:

                                   Roberts

               MacGowan Guthrie Horsfall Koiki

                         McWilliams   Sowerby/Lewis

                      Pinnock     Pollock      Connolly/Hoskins

                                     Etete

I find it hard to believe that this side would do worse than the shower of **** we saw today. What has Brady got to lose? It's not as if we're going to end up creating fewer chances is it?


Great post Bungle. A bit of realism and considering you're usually so positive, this speaks volumes.
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« Reply #13 on: October 02, 2021, 21:54:49 pm »

Agree with everything you said

I've also said 4-2-3-1 is our best option

Like many managers we have had Brady is stubborn and cannot adapt.

He's got his idea and is sticking to it.

We won't see Pollock start, if he won't bring him on two down at home.

Thing us if he goes CC takes over....so it won't get better.
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« Reply #14 on: October 02, 2021, 22:00:49 pm »

I'd argue that the reason they were resorting to 'longball aimless hoof' is that they didn't have the confidence to play it short into the midfield. Why is that? Perhaps because they don't trust the midfielders to keep possession. Perhaps because the midfielders don't want to show for the ball because when they get it there isn't enough movement ahead of them between the lines or on the overlap. We have an overly static and predictable system and there is a failure to rehearse patterns of play. Pumping it forward to Kabamba is the easy option for defenders to take because they know that a loss of possession in the opponents final third will be less catastrophic. The result: sterile risk adverse football.

You seem to echo Brady's claim that Sutton simply 'wanted it more', but I'm not really buying that. Tactical coherence breeds confidence at this level. Sutton have a very simple system and have the personnel (proper target man etc) to make it work. In contrast, we have no clear identity as an attacking force: we're neither a proper long ball team nor a possession-based passing team. We play 4-4-2 but with only one supposedly natural winger. No wonder the players are confused and lack confidence going forward. The one huge source of confidence which we do have is our excellent defence. However, the Rochdale and Sutton games suggest that when you take one of the first choice CBs out, then that confidence is threatened.



 



I didn't hear Bradys interview Bungle and if you're paraphrasing him it sounds like he's trying to defend his players to me (they had a day off but we'll put it right next week type comment?)
I'm saying we struggled against a better team but would have done better wi5hout necessarily matching them had we played with more confidence in ourselves and been less risk adverse and that doesn't have to come from Brady because the players should be able to change what they see is going wrong. However that said, ultimately if we aren't good enough we aren't good enough whatever our formation and game plans are.
That's the opposite of what Brady is saying I think when he says he's happy with his squad even though that's obviously another sound byte.

One thing I noticed which demonsrrates what I mean better than most was our best player Roberts pumping the ball long with every drop kick with haste even though it clearly wasn't working because we had nobody capable of winning the head or holding the ball up. Goalkeeping is quite an easy game, you just have to keep them out and distribute the ball, so I would have thought that after a while he would have thought about either delaying the kick or playing it short even if his remit was long quick ball everytime, but there was never a suggestion of that happening.
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« Reply #15 on: October 02, 2021, 22:04:04 pm »

The primary reason for our relegation last year was a lack of goals.

The strikers (Edmondson, Rose) received a lot of criticism, but the fact
is we simply didn't create enough chances for them. Most of the fanbase
accepted that Brady's hands were tied due to Curle's poor recruitment and looked
forward to what he could do when he brought his own squad in.

In the summer, Brady promised 'bums-off-seats' football. He said we'd
go with two up front and play a more expansive attacking game.

Well, we are now 10 games into the season and by my count we have scored a grand total of 3 league goals from open play (the other 6 being exclusively from corners, free kicks and long-throw ins). We have just failed to register a single shot on target against Sutton United at home.

Up until now our defensive competence has enabled us to grind out results and has papered over the cracks of the creative void at the heart of the team. However, with Guthrie out today and the normally imperious defence severely rattled by a physical Sutton side, the complete lack of attacking threat at the other end was all too evident.

So why has this creative void persisted over two seasons under Brady? IMO, it's far too simplistic to blame the strikers as individuals - it's much deeper and more tactically systemic than that. If they were missing bags of chances then I would be the first to criticise them, but the service simply isn't there. Harry Smith has gone from being a goal-shy no hoper with us to emerging as the 6-goal L2 top scorer at Orient, who have hit 18 goals this year, double our haul: clearly a bit of decent service has done wonders for his confidence.

For me, we're not creating chances because we are too cautious, too predictable and too static. We play a tired old 4-4-2 with Hoskins shoehorned in as a winger who works hard but creates little in terms of crosses or assists. None of the first choice central midfielders have the capacity to drive forward with the ball and commit men and again, none of them have any assists as yet. No one goes 'between the lines'. The only sign of any kind of spark or combination play is the partnership between Koiki and Pinnock on the left, but the lack of any corresponding threat on the right makes us lopsided.
As many have said, it all smacks of Calderwood circa 2003, but without the league-crushing budgetary advantage which eventually led to our promotion.

I'm really tired of this safety first bulls***. It's got the stage where I'd rather see Brady play Pollock in centre mid and lose 4-3 than watch us play another game of sterile chanceless nothingball.

I've said many times that if Brady is really serious about delivering 'bums of seat football' and developing us beyond a mid table basement side then he has to seriously consider ditching 4-4-2 and going with something less predictable. 4-3-3 is out because our forwards don't have the pace or guile to play wide; 3 at the back should probably be resisted because the back 4 have been excellent as a unit. IMO as I've said many times, 4-2-3-1 is the formation which best suits our admittedly limited squad. Our strikers are contributing very little at the moment and it's time to sacrifice one to bring in another creative midfielder:

                                   Roberts

               MacGowan Guthrie Horsfall Koiki

                         McWilliams   Sowerby/Lewis

                      Pinnock     Pollock      Connolly/Hoskins

                                     Etete

I find it hard to believe that this side would do worse than the shower of **** we saw today. What has Brady got to lose? It's not as if we're going to end up creating fewer chances is it?





 




 












You really do rate yourself don't you!
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« Reply #16 on: October 03, 2021, 09:11:23 am »

We've been more entertaining under Brady than under Curle this year, but the actual philosophy behind the style of play isn't too different, it's just a more polished version of it.

I thought there were some promising patterns of play in some of the earlier games this season that indicated we were looking for a solid start but would be expanding our play to be more creative as the season progressed, but the second half at Salford and the entirety of yesterday have been a worrying slide in standards for me.

More revealing though are the choices the management are making in the starting XI at the moment. Selecting Rose and Kabamba up top indicates to me one style of football, because the two are hardly in rip roaring form in front of goal. I really think we should be putting our eggs in the Etete basket. While he hasn't scored in the league yet I've seen enough creativity from him - not to mention the two goals he scored at Coventry - to indicate he is our best choice for getting goals and also the most exciting striker we have to watch.

The lack of action for Scott Pollock I'm starting to find increasingly bizarre as well. I'm not saying he will be the answer, but can we at least give him an extended go to see whether he is - because he's shown far more in the glimpses I've seen of him this year than any of our other midfield players.

I said at the start of this year I would settle for a mid-table finish as long as I saw some clear progress towards embedding a more expansive style of play that would stand us in better stead for future progression. There's of course plenty of time still to do that, but I'm getting the vibe that we're going down the direct route to get results again. Better for this year perhaps, but leaves us in the same old situation should we make the leap to League One, where we've been found out with hoofball time and time again.
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« Reply #17 on: October 03, 2021, 10:09:40 am »

Completely agree that playing pretty much the same attacking players in the same formation game after game and just expecting us to suddenly start scoring goals when thereís been zero sign of it so far is insanity.
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« Reply #18 on: October 03, 2021, 10:48:32 am »

I'd argue that the reason they were resorting to 'longball aimless hoof' is that they didn't have the confidence to play it short into the midfield. Why is that? Perhaps because they don't trust the midfielders to keep possession. Perhaps because the midfielders don't want to show for the ball because when they get it there isn't enough movement ahead of them between the lines or on the overlap. We have an overly static and predictable system and there is a failure to rehearse patterns of play. Pumping it forward to Kabamba is the easy option for defenders to take because they kno  w that a loss of possession in the opponents final third will be less catastrophic. The result: sterile risk adverse football.

You seem to echo Brady's claim that Sutton simply 'wanted it more', but I'm not really buying that. Tactical coherence breeds confidence at this level. Sutton have a very simple system and have the personnel (proper target man etc) to make it work. In contrast, we have no clear identity as an attacking force: we're neither a proper long ball team nor a possession-based passing team. We play 4-4-2 but with only one supposedly natural winger. No wonder the players are confused and lack confidence going forward. The one huge source of confidence which we do have is our excellent defence. However, the Rochdale and Sutton games suggest that when you take one of the first choice CBs out, then that confidence is threatened.


Sorry Bungle canít quite agree with some of the points raised. Previous games this season have been reasonably entertaining; even the disappointing result at Salford we were always in with a chance. We will probably never know the reason why the display was so poor. For the last 24hrs most of us have made somewhat naive excuses like poor team selection, no desire, no flare etc and so it goes on! Simplistically if the  majority of players have a poor game no amount of team selection or even tactics will make little difference.
This is bourne out by the keeper having a good game so ensuring the deficit is minimised after 90mins. As somebody has mentioned if we can bounce back at Hartlepool then we know the Sutton game was an aberration. After all if the defence played ok on Saturday we would probably be moaning about a boring 0-0 draw. Finally it is best to get behind the team forget all the moaning etc and hope for the best.
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« Reply #19 on: October 04, 2021, 08:24:48 am »

We have a paper thin squad, especially at the back, unfortunately budget is everything in football and when you have a bottom half budget, guess where your going to finish?
There are some anomalies but they are very few and far between.
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