Redevelopment Closer Than Ever?

[Mathius]

You are obviously someone ITK at NTFC by the way you post inside info, so why are you asking a question that you know the answer to?

Only on football matters. I'm not a political beast.

[guest3086]

F*ck me, didn't realise North Koreans had taken over Northamptonshire,

Less time monitoring and more action,

I can see why though, if the trust are trying to be civil and make progress, a loose.cannon trust member slagging chairman off on here could potentially make things awkward,

The thing is we are not questioning the fact that the trust should not slag off the chairman on a public forum but being afraid to tell the truth when asked a factual question in case someone at the club heard about it is extraordinary. To be honest it makes me now question the credibility of the trust.

[BackOfTheNet]

To be honest it makes me now question the credibility of the trust.

Only now? Sadly, I think the Trust's relevance is a thing of the past, certainly under the current regime (by that I mean within the Trust itself, although to be honest it probably applies equally to within the club).

[everbrite]

Only now? Sadly, I think the Trust's relevance is a thing of the past, certainly under the current regime (by that I mean within the Trust itself, although to be honest it probably applies equally to within the club).

I don’t - it galvanised support when needed and will probably do so again.
I suspect that many of its critics on here are not even members.

Incidentally how many members does the Trust have?

[Battery Man]

I don’t - it galvanised support when needed and will probably do so again.
I suspect that many of its critics on here are not even members.

Incidentally how many members does the Trust have?

Is it any wonder that lots of fans don't want to be members of the trust when a simple question about whether or not the trust have seen plans for the stand is met with all this cloak and dagger. No one was asking for details but just if something has been seen or not. There are plenty on here on all sides of the argument who are going on about KT not telling the truth or the council not telling the truth, now the group that are supposed to represent the fans wont tell the fans if they have seen something or not after the chairman said they had.

I am sorry but there seems to be a lot of cloak and dagger secrets on all sides of the argument, it is like being back in the playground with all this he said she said bull.

[clarkeysntfc]

Incidentally how many members does the Trust have?

About 700, of which about 100 actually want to receive correspondence via email etc.

[guest3063]

What I don't understand is Kelvin Thomas (NTFC) was the one who came out and said there are plans for the East Stand, during his Facebook session last week. All people are asking now is have The Trust seen these plans. So, why are they worried what NTFC think, maybe I'm missing something but I just don't understand the reasons being given. There seems to be more to this than meets the eye.

[Mathius]

Having just read the statement, it seems to make it clear that the council have done their bit. It's the owners of our football club that are holding things up. As these messages get passed back I would suggest that Kelvin Thomas responds to this immediately, as previously he has laid the blame at NBC's door, but it now seems clear that he[and Bower] want to profit from land which was never part of the original agreement. When the club was purchased, it was for a token amount on the proviso that they finished the east stand. There was never any agreement to development land outside of the boundary from the outset. The council have said they will discuss development of this land once the east stand is completed. Doesn't mean it will favour KT or DB, which is the sticking point. If they don't like this, sell up and move on. It was their error not to include the development of land outside of the boundary at time of purchase.

[BackOfTheNet]

About 700, of which about 100 actually want to receive correspondence via email etc.

Blimey, is that all? I'd assumed there were more. So with 11 people on the board, the board effectively makes up 11% of the active membership!

[guest2995]

The way I see things now is that the council are not holding up the development of the East Stand but have restricted any further development around the ground , thus reducing any possibility of profiteering .
The chairman must now take a grip of the situation and get the stand completed .
It is his responsibility to do so whether the club is up for sale or not .
Let’s face it , it is very unlikely this football club will be sold in its current state .

[rebelspawn]

The way I see things now is that the council are not holding up the development of the East Stand but have restricted any further development around the ground , thus reducing any possibility of profiteering .
The chairman must now take a grip of the situation and get the stand completed .
It is his responsibility to do so whether the club is up for sale or not .
Let’s face it , it is very unlikely this football club will be sold in its current state .

I am just going to play Devil's advocate here:

What if KT is holding off the East stand development because he wants to bundle it with the wider development in order to deliver NTFC something better than the monstrosity of a stand that we have currently?

That's the problem though isn't it, nobody seems to have the full picture, know the actual plan. Its all cloak and daggers from all sides.

[Mathius]

I am just going to play Devil's advocate here:

What if KT is holding off the East stand development because he wants to bundle it with the wider development in order to deliver NTFC something better than the monstrosity of a stand that we have currently?

That's the problem though isn't it, nobody seems to have the full picture, know the actual plan. Its all cloak and daggers from all sides.

All the more reason for KT to clarify. KT has stated previously that they [him and DB] are not trying to obtain extra land but the council say they are. Which is it?

[Battery Man]

All the more reason for KT to clarify. KT has stated previously that they [him and DB] are not trying to obtain extra land but the council say they are. Which is it?

Have the council said that they are trying to obtain extra land or is that just supposition from on here. I don't know and the problem is none of us know who we are getting the truth, half truths and downright lies. I can understand Beds and Randoms frustration and anger more if I knew what the true picture was but as things stand we none of us do.

[Mathius]

Have the council said that they are trying to obtain extra land or is that just supposition from on here. I don't know and the problem is none of us know who we are getting the truth, half truths and downright lies. I can understand Beds and Randoms frustration and anger more if I knew what the true picture was but as things stand we none of us do.

Statement on the trust website. They got it from the council. Please see below:

http://ntfctrust.co.uk/news/article/statement-east-stand-at-sixfields

[rebelspawn]

All the more reason for KT to clarify. KT has stated previously that they [him and DB] are not trying to obtain extra land but the council say they are. Which is it?

My interpretation is as follows:

The council haven't said that KT is trying to get 'extra' land though. The statements from the various parties are not necessarily in direct contradiction to each other either.

The council say that since June last year the east stand can be completed since the leases were dealt with.

KT through CDNL holds the lease for the wider land already, but presumably needs permissions from the council to develop anything. I believe he is wanting to tie these permissions into the completion of the east stand. this may or may not include a better stand/further stadium development rather than just fitting out the current east stand shell.

Both parties issued a statement in January saying that discussions were progressing - i read this to mean discussions about the wider development not just the east stand.

The most recent statement from the trust via comments from NBC re-iterates that the east stand can be completed (as-is with no wider development)and this has been the case since June last year. The trust statement also then goes on to say that the council have confirmed KT is trying to discuss wider development.

so either:

KT may well just be trying to use the completion of the East as leverage to get the permissions he needs for the wider development of the land that could make him personal profit that would not benefit the club. If this is the case then he is not fulfilling the promise he made when he took over (£3m ring fenced for completion of the east stand) and much of the anger on here would be fully warranted in my opinion.

or:

KT is trying to deliver something better for the football club, using the wider development to further develop NTFC's stadium and infrastructure to make it more sustainable long term and provide future revenue streams, whilst also turning a profit for himself. This would be accepted by the majority of fans i think.

For us as supporters though its hard to know who we should be rooting for, we have no idea what KT is planning, how much of the wider development would actually benefit NTFC on an ongoing basis or if it would allow for improved development of the stadium at all.

[GrangeParkCobbler]

The Council were all ready to take the CDNL land back in house until KT came in last minute and bought them out of administration.

The other land doesn't belong to NTFC, never has and never will. The original sale of the land to CDNL first time round had provisos written in that would see money come from the wider development back to the Council. £5m seems to be the figure that I remember. Whether those arrangements still apply today is unknown. If they were though you'd think it was in the Councils benefit to sign off development on that land asap. What happens to the East Stand is of little consequence to the council financially.

However KT did say that money had been set aside to finish that stand.....and note the word finish. Even last week when I asked him about the stand he seemed to say that it would contain 10 boxes which could be increased to 18 at a later date. This suggests to me that the original plans would still be worked to, and the stand would be completed as per Cardozas specs.

If the council are holding out on the other land until KT fulfils that commitment made when taking over the club (and the due diligence that the council had to do to enable KT's takeover to go through as they were a major creditor) then we may have reached stalemate.

Seriously....would you spend 3 million finishing that stand? Where's the return? Especially seeing as they (KT and DB) are already £5m down (tied to the club by way of liabilities)

[rebelspawn]

Seriously....would you spend 3 million finishing that stand? Where's the return? Especially seeing as they (KT and DB) are already £5m down (tied to the club by way of liabilities)

KT gained control of the club, had £10m debt written off based on the fact that he had £4m to put in. £1m to cover unpaid wages HMRC bill etc and £3m to finish the east. If KT is now using wider development as leverage to do ONLY what he said he would anyway when taking over the club, that would be wrong and not in the best interest of the football club, no?

the £5M you mention has nothing to do with the development/council/Land situation. The Chinese money that never arrived but was spent regardless is a KT blunder. The successive appointment of poor managers and their subsequent payoffs, likewise.

[Mathius]

KT gained control of the club, had £10m debt written off based on the fact that he had £4m to put in. £1m to cover unpaid wages HMRC bill etc and £3m to finish the east. If KT is now using wider development as leverage to do ONLY what he said he would anyway when taking over the club, that would be wrong and not in the best interest of the football club, no?

the £5M you mention has nothing to do with the development/council/Land situation. The Chinese money that never arrived but was spent regardless is a KT blunder. The successive appointment of poor managers and their subsequent payoffs, likewise.

The only way for KT/DB to come out of this with any integrity is to disclose their intentions regarding the east stand and surrounding land. No more hiding behind lame excuses that they are unable to inform us of their intentions until such a time that they have a deal with NBC. I agree that they cannot write off their losses against the club because of their own bad decision making. Hope NBC stick to their guns and refuse to discuss further development until such a time the east stand is completed.

[rebelspawn]

The only way for KT/DB to come out of this with any integrity is to disclose their intentions regarding the east stand and surrounding land. No more hiding behind lame excuses that they are unable to inform us of their intentions until such a time that they have a deal with NBC. I agree that they cannot write off their losses against the club because of their own bad decision making. Hope NBC stick to their guns and refuse to discuss further development until such a time the east stand is completed.

That's the problem though. if KT is only planning to finish the east in its current form once the wider development is agreed, than i am in full agreement with the bold statement above and i would support NBC's stance.

If however, KT does have much wider plans for development of NTFC infrastructure that require the wider development approval but will provide future benefit to the club, then i think it is in the club's interest to not finish the stand as-is but instead wait for the wider development approval. in this case i would support KT's current stance.

I think the information needs to be made public either way. Is there nothing that can be done via freedom of information requests to NBC, does anybody know?

[Mathius]

That's the problem though. if KT is only planning to finish the east in its current form once the wider development is agreed, than i am in full agreement with the bold statement above and i would support NBC's stance.

If however, KT does have much wider plans for development of NTFC infrastructure that require the wider development approval but will provide future benefit to the club, then i think it is in the club's interest to not finish the stand as-is but instead wait for the wider development approval. in this case i would support KT's current stance.

I think the information needs to be made public either way. Is there nothing that can be done via freedom of information requests to NBC, does anybody know?

Not sure [re:freedom of info] but KT should tell us his intentions for the wider development. As you say, if NTFC benefit I am open-minded. I don't care if KT/ DB profit if deal beneficial to us. However, if this is just them trying to profiteer after making commitments to purchase club on the cheap then NBC should deny them the opportunity.