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Redevelopment Closer Than Ever?

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Author Topic: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever?  (Read 1287028 times)
Manwork04
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« Reply #30760 on: December 18, 2021, 14:38:15 pm »

Never be able to find that sort of stuff out from the abbreviated accounts that are published.

A look at the last set of filed accounts though does show that "staffing costs" were in the region of £4m...... so when you think that our playing budget (Players wages etc) only takes up half that, perhaps not even that, it does suggest that a lot of money is paid out elsewhere.

Staffing costs of £4m on a company turnover of £5.3m is too high surely? There are a great many other costs involved and not a lot of money left to pay those costs by the look of it.

The accounts also show a figure of £1.1m in "administrative expenses"...... again, surely too high? How can you have admin expenses running at 20% of total turnover?

Kelvin stated yesterday that if we ran the club "in a sustainable way" then we would have the lowest or second lowest wage budget in the league? Is he being serious? We would be below the likes of Sutton, Barrow, Harrogate, Crawley or any other the other League 2 heavyweights?. That statement alone tells me there needs to be a complete overhaul of the club and its finances. We are haemorrhaging money somewhere! We get the same money in from the EFL and Sky as the others do, we don't pay anything to rent the ground, we don't own it and we spend precious little maintaining it, so I struggle to see where the drain on finances is. We don't have a particularly big squad, we only have a modest wage bill.....
I think itís pretty obvious where itís goingÖÖ
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« Reply #30761 on: December 18, 2021, 14:45:57 pm »

Never be able to find that sort of stuff out from the abbreviated accounts that are published.

A look at the last set of filed accounts though does show that "staffing costs" were in the region of £4m...... so when you think that our playing budget (Players wages etc) only takes up half that, perhaps not even that, it does suggest that a lot of money is paid out elsewhere.

Staffing costs of £4m on a company turnover of £5.3m is too high surely? There are a great many other costs involved and not a lot of money left to pay those costs by the look of it.

The accounts also show a figure of £1.1m in "administrative expenses"...... again, surely too high? How can you have admin expenses running at 20% of total turnover?

Kelvin stated yesterday that if we ran the club "in a sustainable way" then we would have the lowest or second lowest wage budget in the league? Is he being serious? We would be below the likes of Sutton, Barrow, Harrogate, Crawley or any other the other League 2 heavyweights?. That statement alone tells me there needs to be a complete overhaul of the club and its finances. We are haemorrhaging money somewhere! We get the same money in from the EFL and Sky as the others do, we don't pay anything to rent the ground, we don't own it and we spend precious little maintaining it, so I struggle to see where the drain on finances is. We don't have a particularly big squad, we only have a modest wage bill.....

If you assume £2m goes on support staff, if there were 50 people thatís an average fully costed head of £40k.
No idea how many people are employed and know it was discussed in the past. Prem clubs can have up to 1,000 behind the scenes. Regardless itís difficult to see how we are getting value for that sort of spend.
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« Reply #30762 on: December 18, 2021, 14:57:58 pm »

Looking back at the last few sets of accounts the number of staff employed according to the 2017 set of accounts was 173, in the 2020 accounts this number is now 287.

I assume that most of the difference is the result of bringing the catering back "in house" but then those extra employees wouldn't be placing a major burden on wage bills.... a few hours every other week is not going to amount to much.
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« Reply #30763 on: December 18, 2021, 15:00:34 pm »

Never be able to find that sort of stuff out from the abbreviated accounts that are published.

A look at the last set of filed accounts though does show that "staffing costs" were in the region of £4m...... so when you think that our playing budget (Players wages etc) only takes up half that, perhaps not even that, it does suggest that a lot of money is paid out elsewhere.

Staffing costs of £4m on a company turnover of £5.3m is too high surely? There are a great many other costs involved and not a lot of money left to pay those costs by the look of it.

The accounts also show a figure of £1.1m in "administrative expenses"...... again, surely too high? How can you have admin expenses running at 20% of total turnover?

Kelvin stated yesterday that if we ran the club "in a sustainable way" then we would have the lowest or second lowest wage budget in the league? Is he being serious? We would be below the likes of Sutton, Barrow, Harrogate, Crawley or any other the other League 2 heavyweights?. That statement alone tells me there needs to be a complete overhaul of the club and its finances. We are haemorrhaging money somewhere! We get the same money in from the EFL and Sky as the others do, we don't pay anything to rent the ground, we don't own it and we spend precious little maintaining it, so I struggle to see where the drain on finances is. We don't have a particularly big squad, we only have a modest wage bill.....


Whilst Iím not automatically in agreement with Mannyís conclusion itís certainly clear these figures donít seem to add up compared with comparative or even lower net revenue clubs - unless of course there is a directorís salary in that £4m wage bill - nothing illegal or even wrong in that and as a private company NTFC under no obligation to publish more information on their accounts, but transparency and detail seem do seem somewhat opaque.
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« Reply #30764 on: December 18, 2021, 15:45:40 pm »

So Kelvin and David are loading the club with debt while seemingly taking money out, itís a smart move because it will save them 38.1% dividend tax assuming they earn over £150k in the UK when they come to sell just leaving CGT.
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« Reply #30765 on: December 18, 2021, 15:47:15 pm »

Never be able to find that sort of stuff out from the abbreviated accounts that are published.

A look at the last set of filed accounts though does show that "staffing costs" were in the region of £4m...... so when you think that our playing budget (Players wages etc) only takes up half that, perhaps not even that, it does suggest that a lot of money is paid out elsewhere.

Staffing costs of £4m on a company turnover of £5.3m is too high surely? There are a great many other costs involved and not a lot of money left to pay those costs by the look of it.

The accounts also show a figure of £1.1m in "administrative expenses"...... again, surely too high? How can you have admin expenses running at 20% of total turnover?

Kelvin stated yesterday that if we ran the club "in a sustainable way" then we would have the lowest or second lowest wage budget in the league? Is he being serious? We would be below the likes of Sutton, Barrow, Harrogate, Crawley or any other the other League 2 heavyweights?. That statement alone tells me there needs to be a complete overhaul of the club and its finances. We are haemorrhaging money somewhere! We get the same money in from the EFL and Sky as the others do, we don't pay anything to rent the ground, we don't own it and we spend precious little maintaining it, so I struggle to see where the drain on finances is. We don't have a particularly big squad, we only have a modest wage bill.....
It is all very puzzling isn't it?
Almost as much as this assertion that an average league two club has to lose 800k per annum and an equivalent league one club 2 million in order to tread water.
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« Reply #30766 on: December 18, 2021, 15:48:11 pm »

Grass isnt always greener

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2021/12/16/daryl-morey-crypto-nfts-english-soccer/

No puke emoji for me to put at the end of that sadly.
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« Reply #30767 on: December 18, 2021, 16:53:33 pm »

So Kelvin and David are loading the club with debt while seemingly taking money out, itís a smart move because it will save them 38.1% dividend tax assuming they earn over £150k in the UK when they come to sell just leaving CGT.

As non residents any tax liability would only apply in their country of residence, so any rates quoted by the HMRC are void in their case. Just saying.
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« Reply #30768 on: December 18, 2021, 16:59:12 pm »

Grass isnt always greener

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2021/12/16/daryl-morey-crypto-nfts-english-soccer/

No puke emoji for me to put at the end of that sadly.

That can only end badly!! Bradford City are the team they are talking about/with
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« Reply #30769 on: December 18, 2021, 17:02:26 pm »

As non residents any tax liability would only apply in their country of residence, so any rates quoted by the HMRC are void in their case. Just saying.
You pay CGT on Land and Property irrespective of where you live, sale of shares is in the country of domicile.
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« Reply #30770 on: December 18, 2021, 17:10:09 pm »

You pay CGT on Land and Property irrespective of where you live, sale of shares is in the country of domicile.

You wouldnít pay 38.1% on any dividends though?
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« Reply #30771 on: December 18, 2021, 17:11:00 pm »

I did point out a few weeks ago that Newport County's turnover last year was £3.65M which is £310,000 less than our staff costs and they still made a profit of £307,000 with an average gate of 1,400 less than ours. Something doesn't seem to add up, does it ?
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« Reply #30772 on: December 18, 2021, 17:12:48 pm »

That can only end badly!! Bradford City are the team they are talking about/with
Even if it doesnít itís pyramid selling at its finest. The natural conclusion of all this is that every club gets owned by a cash rich entity. They canít all play in the Prem can they?
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« Reply #30773 on: December 18, 2021, 19:01:09 pm »

Iíve heard from various sources that you like to run and tell KT and JW all thatís going on, especially on this forum so you could proof the questions for the owners?  Tongue



WellÖ Your sources are as honest as you..  Grin I have spoke to JW once in my life. For about 10 seconds. As for KT. I havenít spoken to him in over 3 years. Then it was only to ask him some pertinent questions about the redevelopment. As I have said to you over and over again. Iím not part of the game. 
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« Reply #30774 on: December 18, 2021, 19:17:51 pm »

I think itís pretty obvious where itís goingÖÖ

But have you got the balls to say itÖ Or are you another noise from the terraces, peddling speculation. For as long as I can remember, we have had to endure the likes of GPC and like minded groups/individuals hinting that something just doesnít seem right. WellÖ Is it, or isnít it right? Is something totally untoward going on or not? Because repeating the ďwriting is on the wallĒ mantra year after year isnít brave. Or groundbreaking. If there is any evidence of impropriety, have the sense of conviction to come out and challenge. Personally, I have no idea. My main reason for leaving the Trust board, was because it seemed to go over the same ground constantly. I genuinely like the people on there. But it was like Groundhog day at every meeting. I feel that all these years later, we are at the same junction. I mean, Grange Park Cobbler.. Are you saying something corrupt is happening. ManworkÖ Are you saying something corrupt is going on? What exactly is the score as you see it. Clear it up for us?
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« Reply #30775 on: December 18, 2021, 19:22:02 pm »

Still waiting for Manwork's last big news...oh that's right he didn't actually know anything.
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« Reply #30776 on: December 18, 2021, 21:44:40 pm »

Can you even say that anything corrupt went on with David Cardoza?
When over £1m has been spent investigating the last one without an outcome, what chance does a common fan have to know what is actually going on, let alone say it?!
Our recent owners just havenít run a very successful or profitable business, or improved the fan experience. Other than that who knows?
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« Reply #30777 on: December 18, 2021, 22:08:09 pm »

Can you even say that anything corrupt went on with David Cardoza?

 Grin Grin
Bless
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« Reply #30778 on: December 18, 2021, 22:12:57 pm »

Grin Grin
Bless

Innocent until proven guilty  Grin  Tongue
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« Reply #30779 on: December 18, 2021, 22:25:33 pm »

Innocent until proven guilty  Grin  Tongue


Did wonder why he was arrested/questioned?
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