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Redevelopment Closer Than Ever?

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JollyCobbler
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« Reply #26540 on: February 24, 2020, 17:41:37 pm »

There is no comparison on any level.

I wasn't the one who compared the two situations. But I'd agree you're right in saying the cases differ massively, because it's obvious those up the road are actively trying to progress things, and in so doing they hope to advance the club.  Wink

That's my line cast. I'll sit back now and wait for the next bite. Grin
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« Reply #26541 on: February 24, 2020, 21:28:06 pm »

The thing is £4million to complete the East Stand, (if that is the figure) will never generate enough income to justify the expense. You'd want a big increase in capacity and corporate facilities in any expansion plans. The East Stand in its current shell doesn't give us that.
Is it not called the Alwyn Hargrave Stand anymore btw?
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« Reply #26542 on: February 25, 2020, 06:45:45 am »

The thing is £4million to complete the East Stand, (if that is the figure) will never generate enough income to justify the expense. You'd want a big increase in capacity and corporate facilities in any expansion plans. The East Stand in its current shell doesn't give us that.
Is it not called the Alwyn Hargrave Stand anymore btw?


Think small and you stay small.  That is the problem we have with our current and previous owners.  Good, progressive ownership backed by owners willing to invest long-term has never happened in Northampton and so why should we ever believe that it will?   Meanwhile consider what is in progress at what we like to think of as rival clubs like Posh, MK and Luton.  We are being left behind in their wake.

The plain facts are that our owners were allowed to buy the club for a nominal £1.00 by the Council on the understanding they would complete the stand.  KT gave proof of funds to NBC he now says of £11 million.  At the time in November 2015 the £4 million was said to be available by KT to finish the stand and invest in the club.  The failure was by the Council in not tying down KT/DB in legally binding document with a timetable. Not the first instance of ineptness by the Council in its Sixfields dealings.  We the supporters have been let down by both our owners and the Council.

As to the price of finishing the East Stand to anything remotely acceptable, no plans or costings have been published by KT who continues to operate in a secretive, opaque way. The lack of transparency is very suitable for his modus operandi and if the reaction of some supporters is deep suspicion KT can hardly complain .  KT/DB were only able to acquire CDNL from its Liquidator for £170,000 by them striking a deal with Buckingham Group, the main creditor of CDNL.  On what terms that deal was struck have never been disclosed.  Another example of opaqueness. 

On the major matter of club infrastructure our owners are failing the supporters.  Every decision is delayed, the latest example being safe-standing after KT’s own survey showed a 85% majority of those canvassed in favour.  KT now wants further consultation on safe-standing but there is absolutely no consultation with supporters on the East Stand or wider development plans.

If supporters think it sufficient that the the owners pay the day to day overheads so that supporters can tip up every 2 weeks to watch L2 football (mingled with occasional short-lived forays in L1) and even after over 4 years of spin remain hopeful that under the current ownership something good may happen with the stadium at some indeterminable date in the future then I differ with them. 

For me a better future lies with adopting the Bundesliga form of ownership with the majority control of the club in community hands and local businesses being involved as investors.  It works well in Germany and we can repeat the best aspects and adapt it to our English needs.  Community ownership is increasing elsewhere, especially in Scotland where Hearts, Motherwell, St Mirren and Partick Thistle are leading the way.  It should come to Northampton. 

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« Reply #26543 on: February 25, 2020, 10:38:43 am »

Think small and you stay small.  That is the problem we have with our current and previous owners.  Good, progressive ownership backed by owners willing to invest long-term has never happened in Northampton and so why should we ever believe that it will?   Meanwhile consider what is in progress at what we like to think of as rival clubs like Posh, MK and Luton.  We are being left behind in their wake.

The plain facts are that our owners were allowed to buy the club for a nominal £1.00 by the Council on the understanding they would complete the stand.  KT gave proof of funds to NBC he now says of £11 million.  At the time in November 2015 the £4 million was said to be available by KT to finish the stand and invest in the club.  The failure was by the Council in not tying down KT/DB in legally binding document with a timetable. Not the first instance of ineptness by the Council in its Sixfields dealings.  We the supporters have been let down by both our owners and the Council.

As to the price of finishing the East Stand to anything remotely acceptable, no plans or costings have been published by KT who continues to operate in a secretive, opaque way. The lack of transparency is very suitable for his modus operandi and if the reaction of some supporters is deep suspicion KT can hardly complain .  KT/DB were only able to acquire CDNL from its Liquidator for £170,000 by them striking a deal with Buckingham Group, the main creditor of CDNL.  On what terms that deal was struck have never been disclosed.  Another example of opaqueness. 

On the major matter of club infrastructure our owners are failing the supporters.  Every decision is delayed, the latest example being safe-standing after KT’s own survey showed a 85% majority of those canvassed in favour.  KT now wants further consultation on safe-standing but there is absolutely no consultation with supporters on the East Stand or wider development plans.

If supporters think it sufficient that the the owners pay the day to day overheads so that supporters can tip up every 2 weeks to watch L2 football (mingled with occasional short-lived forays in L1) and even after over 4 years of spin remain hopeful that under the current ownership something good may happen with the stadium at some indeterminable date in the future then I differ with them. 

For me a better future lies with adopting the Bundesliga form of ownership with the majority control of the club in community hands and local businesses being involved as investors.  It works well in Germany and we can repeat the best aspects and adapt it to our English needs.  Community ownership is increasing elsewhere, especially in Scotland where Hearts, Motherwell, St Mirren and Partick Thistle are leading the way.  It should come to Northampton. 


If it is the way forward DO IT !!!

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« Reply #26544 on: February 25, 2020, 10:54:37 am »

There is absolutely no reason at all why KT and the board cannot update everyone on why the East Stand has not progressed.
People have the right to know because they took the club over saying they would complete it . They haven’t done so and it’s a mess .
The football club lacks leadership and purpose . We are drifting and no one seems to really care apart from the supporters .
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« Reply #26545 on: February 25, 2020, 12:23:22 pm »

From the outside, the club appears to be drifting along, being taken whichever way the prevailing wind of the on field football takes us.
The perception is that there is very little influence on that direction by any other forces to build up a head of steam to reach a targeted destination.
We may reach that destination or we may end up shipwrecked on a deserted beach.  But with a lack of on-board announcements the passengers continue to speculate on whether we will have the appropriate clothing, visa's, inoculations and wherewithal to sustain us at the ports along the way...or should they disembark at the next port of call?
I sense that the frustration is mounting and could gather significant momentum. 
The captain of the ship has no obligation to inform the passengers of the intended navigable course and destination but in order to keep them from the prospect of a mutiny or disembarking at the next opportunity, I would suggest that an announcement of substance and believe-ability (not the bland of the past) would go some way towards averting that and bring us all a lot closer together.
 
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« Reply #26546 on: February 25, 2020, 12:52:53 pm »

From the outside, the club appears to be drifting along, being taken whichever way the prevailing wind of the on field football takes us.
The perception is that there is very little influence on that direction by any other forces to build up a head of steam to reach a targeted destination.
We may reach that destination or we may end up shipwrecked on a deserted beach.  But with a lack of on-board announcements the passengers continue to speculate on whether we will have the appropriate clothing, visa's, inoculations and wherewithal to sustain us at the ports along the way...or should they disembark at the next port of call?
I sense that the frustration is mounting and could gather significant momentum. 
The captain of the ship has no obligation to inform the passengers of the intended navigable course and destination but in order to keep them from the prospect of a mutiny or disembarking at the next opportunity, I would suggest that an announcement of substance and believe-ability (not the bland of the past) would go some way towards averting that and bring us all a lot closer together.
 


Agreed.

Alternatively, it's called managing your customers' expectations ... personally I'd prefer bad news to no news/wild speculation.
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« Reply #26547 on: February 25, 2020, 14:57:00 pm »

As I have said repeatedly.. Perhaps KT & DB are following the same route as Peterborough. There’s a lot of difference in the land that Boro sit on. And certainly a gap as wide as a planet between the two councils.

You’ll always get those that offer nothing more than criticism.

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« Reply #26548 on: February 25, 2020, 15:18:57 pm »

As I have said repeatedly.. Perhaps KT & DB are following the same route as Peterborough. There’s a lot of difference in the land that Boro sit on. And certainly a gap as wide as a planet between the two councils.

You’ll always get those that offer nothing more than criticism.


Not having a go at you here Tel, but what exactly have KT and DB offered us?
They promised to finish the east stand and said they had £4m ring fenced to do it, nearl FIVE YEARS later nothing, in fact the ground is looking really neglected, peeling paint broken windows etc.
It’s time for the supporters to unite behind the trust and once again demand ANSWERS.....
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« Reply #26549 on: February 25, 2020, 15:38:23 pm »

Think small and you stay small.  That is the problem we have with our current and previous owners.  Good, progressive ownership backed by owners willing to invest long-term has never happened in Northampton and so why should we ever believe that it will?   Meanwhile consider what is in progress at what we like to think of as rival clubs like Posh, MK and Luton.  We are being left behind in their wake.

The plain facts are that our owners were allowed to buy the club for a nominal £1.00 by the Council on the understanding they would complete the stand.  KT gave proof of funds to NBC he now says of £11 million.  At the time in November 2015 the £4 million was said to be available by KT to finish the stand and invest in the club.  The failure was by the Council in not tying down KT/DB in legally binding document with a timetable. Not the first instance of ineptness by the Council in its Sixfields dealings.  We the supporters have been let down by both our owners and the Council.

As to the price of finishing the East Stand to anything remotely acceptable, no plans or costings have been published by KT who continues to operate in a secretive, opaque way. The lack of transparency is very suitable for his modus operandi and if the reaction of some supporters is deep suspicion KT can hardly complain .  KT/DB were only able to acquire CDNL from its Liquidator for £170,000 by them striking a deal with Buckingham Group, the main creditor of CDNL.  On what terms that deal was struck have never been disclosed.  Another example of opaqueness. 

On the major matter of club infrastructure our owners are failing the supporters.  Every decision is delayed, the latest example being safe-standing after KT’s own survey showed a 85% majority of those canvassed in favour.  KT now wants further consultation on safe-standing but there is absolutely no consultation with supporters on the East Stand or wider development plans.

If supporters think it sufficient that the the owners pay the day to day overheads so that supporters can tip up every 2 weeks to watch L2 football (mingled with occasional short-lived forays in L1) and even after over 4 years of spin remain hopeful that under the current ownership something good may happen with the stadium at some indeterminable date in the future then I differ with them. 

For me a better future lies with adopting the Bundesliga form of ownership with the majority control of the club in community hands and local businesses being involved as investors.  It works well in Germany and we can repeat the best aspects and adapt it to our English needs.  Community ownership is increasing elsewhere, especially in Scotland where Hearts, Motherwell, St Mirren and Partick Thistle are leading the way.  It should come to Northampton. 



You repeatedly maintain this ideology but then fail to back it up.

If you genuinely believe this is workable,come up with the business plans and specifics that you can use to sell your vision to the Clubs supporters. I always assumed you had close links with the trust. Perhaps they can add meat to the bones?
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« Reply #26550 on: February 25, 2020, 15:54:15 pm »

Pedi, dont cloud the issue by asking for facts  Grin
As for the German example  which one is that ? The one for the team topping the League or the one in 2nd place ? Both run differently I believe.
Also fan ownership in the UK, nicely cherry picked the teams in Scotland, ignoring the likes of Wycombe,  Portsmouth and Wimbledon. 
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« Reply #26551 on: February 25, 2020, 16:05:25 pm »

Pedi, dont cloud the issue by asking for facts  Grin
As for the German example  which one is that ? The one for the team topping the League or the one in 2nd place ? Both run differently I believe.
Also fan ownership in the UK, nicely cherry picked the teams in Scotland, ignoring the likes of Wycombe,  Portsmouth and Wimbledon. 
Ok, so is the answer just to sit around and do nothing?
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« Reply #26552 on: February 25, 2020, 17:02:33 pm »

Pedi, dont cloud the issue by asking for facts  Grin
As for the German example  which one is that ? The one for the team topping the League or the one in 2nd place ? Both run differently I believe.
Also fan ownership in the UK, nicely cherry picked the teams in Scotland, ignoring the likes of Wycombe,  Portsmouth and Wimbledon. 
I note that all the English teams are above us in the League. PS You forgot Exeter, who are also above us.
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« Reply #26553 on: February 25, 2020, 17:07:41 pm »

Quite true Barton, also true that two of the three decided that being fan owned in league one was not the way forward.
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« Reply #26554 on: February 25, 2020, 17:38:38 pm »

Ok, so is the answer just to sit around and do nothing?

Until someone comes up with an alternative,of course it is.
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« Reply #26555 on: February 25, 2020, 17:44:29 pm »

Ok, so is the answer just to sit around and do nothing?

Why don’t  you galvanise like minded fans ? Otherwise you are also fannying around talking about it! Dreamer?

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« Reply #26556 on: February 25, 2020, 18:03:43 pm »

In which case, Everbrite, can you be galvanised or are you one of those contented with things as they are?
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« Reply #26557 on: February 25, 2020, 18:08:47 pm »

You repeatedly maintain this ideology but then fail to back it up.

If you genuinely believe this is workable,come up with the business plans and specifics that you can use to sell your vision to the Clubs supporters. I always assumed you had close links with the trust. Perhaps they can add meat to the bones?

Quite lot of work is going on is all I can say.  The need is to be as prepared as is possible.  You do realise that KT is still trying to sell the club don't you?
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« Reply #26558 on: February 25, 2020, 18:21:27 pm »

Quite lot of work is going on is all I can say.  The need is to be as prepared as is possible.  You do realise that KT is still trying to sell the club don't you?

Only if you've got £4.5m in your pocket he is!  Grin
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« Reply #26559 on: February 25, 2020, 18:23:58 pm »

It will fetch what it is worth.  Someone may be disappointed!!
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