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Redevelopment Closer Than Ever?

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« Reply #27160 on: August 14, 2020, 21:23:13 pm »

I'm sorry, but as long as the Trust go on about fan ownership I don't want them anywhere near the club. And as to having a place on the board that has been mentioned on here, why with their paltry share holding?
What the media and the council need to understand is that the Trust do not represent the majority of the fanbase and are in effect insignificant.

I have to agree. On no account should the trust be anywhere near any  involvement with running the Football club.
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« Reply #27161 on: August 14, 2020, 21:38:57 pm »

Tosh.

What do you disagree with?
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« Reply #27162 on: August 14, 2020, 22:02:22 pm »

What do you disagree with?

Just give it a rest.
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« Reply #27163 on: August 14, 2020, 22:18:44 pm »

What do you disagree with?

You.
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« Reply #27164 on: August 14, 2020, 22:37:18 pm »

It seems to me that the Trust have declined the offer of the Zoom meeting without coming outright and saying it? Presumably the clubs response is looking to clarify that?

You can read through all of that and prevaricate over the detail for literally weeks, however let’s cut to the chase. The clubs owners are neither now or at any point in the future going to develop the East Stand without an iron clad guarantee that they are getting their money back. Unless that principle is embraced by all parties including the council, the trust and the support base it won’t happen. Everyone can talk about “commitments” who said what to who, principles and responsibilities but it will achieve absolutely nothing. All the commentary, argument and opinion in the world isn’t going to change the fact that the East Stand will remain as is until the owners have an ROI strategy that is satisfactory for them, and only them. At this point there are 3 options.

1. Accept the owners proposals
2. Come up with an alternative ROI for the owners that they find acceptable.
3. Leave the East Stand as it is and move on until such time as there are new owners and then repeat points 1, 2 and possibly 3.

The relationship between the Trust and the owners is it seems is beyond repair? But speaking as a life member of the Trust until the board embark on a regular process of engaging with, embracing and representing the views of its membership I would rather not see them involved in this process or the future proposals of the club? Apparently all trust members are equal, but some are more equal than others? And the others are perhaps acting according to their personal agendas without reasonable input of its own membership? Only my opinion but I feel I am entitled, and it seems to be a common theme of complaint from what I can tell?

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« Reply #27165 on: August 14, 2020, 22:39:59 pm »

It seems to me that the Trust have declined the offer of the Zoom meeting without coming outright and saying it? Presumably the clubs response is looking to clarify that?

You can read through all of that and prevaricate over the detail for literally weeks, however let’s cut to the chase. The clubs owners are neither now or at any point in the future going to develop the East Stand without an iron clad guarantee that they are getting their money back. Unless that principle is embraced by all parties including the council, the trust and the support base it won’t happen. Everyone can talk about “commitments” who said what to who, principles and responsibilities but it will achieve absolutely nothing. All the commentary, argument and opinion in the world isn’t going to change the fact that the East Stand will remain as is until the owners have an ROI strategy that is satisfactory for them, and only them. At this point there are 3 options.

1. Accept the owners proposals
2. Come up with an alternative ROI for the owners that they find acceptable.
3. Leave the East Stand as it is and move on until such time as there are new owners and then repeat points 1, 2 and possibly 3.

The relationship between the Trust and the owners is it seems is beyond repair? But speaking as a life member of the Trust until the board embark on a regular process of engaging with, embracing and representing the views of its membership I would rather not see them involved in this process or the future proposals of the club? Apparently all trust members are equal, but some are more equal than others? And the others are perhaps acting according to their personal agendas without reasonable input of its own membership? Only my opinion but I feel I am entitled, and it seems to be a common theme of complaint from what I can tell?



I'd agree with all of that.
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« Reply #27166 on: August 14, 2020, 22:40:23 pm »

It seems to me that the Trust have declined the offer of the Zoom meeting without coming outright and saying it? Presumably the clubs response is looking to clarify that?

You can read through all of that and prevaricate over the detail for literally weeks, however let’s cut to the chase. The clubs owners are neither now or at any point in the future going to develop the East Stand without an iron clad guarantee that they are getting their money back. Unless that principle is embraced by all parties including the council, the trust and the support base it won’t happen. Everyone can talk about “commitments” who said what to who, principles and responsibilities but it will achieve absolutely nothing. All the commentary, argument and opinion in the world isn’t going to change the fact that the East Stand will remain as is until the owners have an ROI strategy that is satisfactory for them, and only them. At this point there are 3 options.

1. Accept the owners proposals
2. Come up with an alternative ROI for the owners that they find acceptable.
3. Leave the East Stand as it is and move on until such time as there are new owners and then repeat points 1, 2 and possibly 3.

The relationship between the Trust and the owners is it seems is beyond repair? But speaking as a life member of the Trust until the board embark on a regular process of engaging with, embracing and representing the views of its membership I would rather not see them involved in this process or the future proposals of the club? Apparently all trust members are equal, but some are more equal than others? And the others are perhaps acting according to their personal agendas without reasonable input of its own membership? Only my opinion but I feel I am entitled, and it seems to be a common theme of complaint from what I can tell?



I cannot believe how accurate that last paragraph is from someone that is an outsider to both parties.
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« Reply #27167 on: August 15, 2020, 05:02:17 am »

I understand the Trust is looking at future options for our club.
I understand KT and DB's path to progress the situation.

My concern is the timescale for decisions (if any) from the current NBC and  future configureation of the Council including South Northamptonshire Councillors.

Unless KT can drive a negotiation forward to a conclusion THIS year with NBC then nothing will happen for another 2 or 3 years (or if at all !!).
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« Reply #27168 on: August 15, 2020, 07:46:15 am »

The point the Trust makes about the switch to a unitary authority is a valid one (although I'm sure it's not news to anyone). The decisions that need to be made to allow the wider redevelopment to take place are potentially a bit sticky, and as such could attract negative attention from the wider electorate in the wake of the missing millions shenanigans.

I hope the council aren't kicking the can down the road to avoid making a potentially contentious decision themselves.
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« Reply #27169 on: August 15, 2020, 07:59:43 am »

The point the Trust makes about the switch to a unitary authority is a valid one (although I'm sure it's not news to anyone). The decisions that need to be made to allow the wider redevelopment to take place are potentially a bit sticky, and as such could attract negative attention from the wider electorate in the wake of the missing millions shenanigans.

I hope the council aren't kicking the can down the road to avoid making a potentially contentious decision themselves.
Totally agree.

Over Cllr Hadland & Co.
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« Reply #27170 on: August 15, 2020, 09:42:45 am »

The point the Trust makes about the switch to a unitary authority is a valid one (although I'm sure it's not news to anyone). The decisions that need to be made to allow the wider redevelopment to take place are potentially a bit sticky, and as such could attract negative attention from the wider electorate in the wake of the missing millions shenanigans.

I hope the council aren't kicking the can down the road to avoid making a potentially contentious decision themselves.

If this was in happening, in any number of other towns/cities, it would have been resolved by now. The Trust board and the councils assertation that due diligence has to be adhered to, so as to achieve an appropriate end, is rubbish. This issue has not risen out of scars from previous encounters with NTFC. It is a product of a non functioning council. Who shouldn’t need any appointed body, or individual to remind them of their responsibility to the supporters of NTFC and the people of Northampton.

I defy anyone to tell me that we have not arrived at this point, due to another massive mistake by the council at the inception of their dealings with KT & DB. My opinion has always been the same. I will not enter into a slanging match about KT, because I said right from the start, that the door was left open by the council for movement around the surrounding land. Anybody can look back and find post after post by me, stating that the council should be in receipt of signed paperwork, overseen by their legal department, listing the obligations of the new owners on the lease.

The bottom line is as plane as the nose on anyone’s face. Forget about the mythical gang of local businessman. Forget about other millionaires, who have been touted by the the Trust board as possible buyers/investors. None of them cared about NTFC enough to risk a penny. The reason we are in the mess we are, is clearly down to a total lack of due diligence at the end of the Cardoza era, and the start of the KT one. An opportunity to exploit (as most owners would of) the land situation and gild the Lilly about what future holds, was all to easy, without a firm commitment in writing and appropriate legal scrutiny. So where was the council then, and indeed, where was the Trust board???

So once again we arrive at another basket case of a situation. KT has only just come out of hiding. The Trust board are now I the business of writing ambiguous protracted responses. As I stated recently, the club and the support are now total victims of this proxy warn. We have KT on one side offering an all to familiar model of development based purely on enabling money from the land. Look how well that went last time 🙄. Then we have the Trust talking about fan ownership. Who would those “fans” be? Do any of the the Trust board see themselves in any future role at a fan run club?

I’m all for straight forward honesty from all parties on this. I suggest that if all parties are genuinely acting in the best interest of me, and the rest of the support, let’s have a one off meeting with all of you in one room. A genuine open forum. Because.... Apparently, nobody has anything to hide. So I’d like to see that in practice. Let’s see who really has the honesty to really embrace the support and people of this town face to face...
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« Reply #27171 on: August 15, 2020, 11:38:50 am »

Amen.
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« Reply #27172 on: August 15, 2020, 13:18:14 pm »

Northampton Town FC was always a “lost leader” for KT and DB to get their hands on the land.
The council, as Tel has said, have once again not covered themselves in glory by not making it a legal requirement of purchasing the club for £1 to finish the east stand.
An MoU is basically worthless, I have written and signed many. All an MoU does is create a framework for cooperation, nothing more.
This whole situation is six of one and half a dozen to the other, unfortunately has now become is pi55ing contest between the owners and the council with the trust somewhere in the middle. The whole situation needs arbitration from a independent body, my old buddies at Turner and Townsend could arbitrate and draw up robust legal contracts that would be fair to both sides because one thing is for sure the incumbents will keep bickering and blaming each other infinitely and the only ones to suffer is us the supporters.
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« Reply #27173 on: August 15, 2020, 14:23:56 pm »


An MoU is basically worthless, I have written and signed many. All an MoU does is create a framework for cooperation, nothing more.


Pleased you put that in writing because a lot of people do not seem to understand that - and whilst it doesn't entirely let KT off the hook as implying something is going to be done and then not doing it (in a reasonable time frame) is in my opinion misleading but certainly not illegal or even breaking a promise.
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« Reply #27174 on: August 15, 2020, 15:59:59 pm »

Northampton Town FC was always a “lost leader” for KT and DB to get their hands on the land.
The council, as Tel has said, have once again not covered themselves in glory by not making it a legal requirement of purchasing the club for £1 to finish the east stand.
An MoU is basically worthless, I have written and signed many. All an MoU does is create a framework for cooperation, nothing more.
This whole situation is six of one and half a dozen to the other, unfortunately has now become is pi55ing contest between the owners and the council with the trust somewhere in the middle. The whole situation needs arbitration from a independent body, my old buddies at Turner and Townsend could arbitrate and draw up robust legal contracts that would be fair to both sides because one thing is for sure the incumbents will keep bickering and blaming each other infinitely and the only ones to suffer is us the supporters.


Spot on, a great post.

As a fan, not living in Northants, I find this long standing impasse and the (apparently) insurmountable complexities behind securing a f***ing resolution for that skeleton of an East Stand sad, just overwhelmingly sad.
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« Reply #27175 on: August 15, 2020, 19:56:00 pm »

Down Paradise Row just thought it was an interesting comment for him to make seeing as he was originally saying how much the club would benefit.....
In the beginning it was all meant moo the you if you are yes The East is having a concourse too isn't it? So the same problem would now arise there...unless there was something like a roller shutter built in to partition off part of the concourse. I haven't been able to open the plans to look at them but the directors box is moving to the East so does that mean the end of the comfy seats in the west or will they be available to the minions now? Also, is the press box staying in the West? I thought    this for the umpteenth time Why is Manowork so camp. Had any legally binding commitment been sought to complete the stand, a valuation of millions would have been instantaneously slapped on a bankrupt second division club days from going out of business and we would have gone down the toilet? So councillor Cecil. is suggesting a commitment was given that the owners wouldn’t formally agree to? Therefore it’s not a commitment, it’s more of an indication of intent subject to circumstance? So in other words completely worthless and irrelevant commentary. Let’s be honest the council sought some sort of vague assurance as political capital for use in pointless meetings such as the one under discussion, a sort of get out of jail free card to appease any criticism? If you want an example of how flexible, robust and subjective the due diligence and outcome protocols of the council are in its procedures,Roger of earls Barton is a posh Sparkie his previous attempt to fix the mince was to add extra spice, Larry said no this time, the ground was allegedly subject to criminal ways criminal ways(Case 1980@s) Everyone has to be very careful to ensure that as and when the East Stand is completed, both the club and the council must be seen to be beyond reproach - both for the supporters and the citizens of Northampton. Investment in completion of the stand can only happen when it is financially viable for the club to do so and when the economic conditions are right. I think it is right  and processes, it’s all here in this response? An organisation poorly equipped and often completely out of its depth in these circumstances as history has proved time and time again. When all said and done if the procedures and um yes  there was talk of "improving" the West as part of this development.....it just seems like only the East is being done, therefore improvement to the other three stands will be a long way off. to be about retail wasn't it? That's where the big money would come from, so the words of the council leader when he says about 'a small amount of retail' do not really start the pound signs flashing!!
It all depends on what type of development ends up there...two shops, a vets, a pub, a hotel and a skate park (for example!) wouldn't bring in tha much would it?  On Mother Kelly's doorstep,Down Paradise Row,I'd sit along o' Nelly,She'd sit along o'Joe O'tooleBut Nelly was the smartest down our alley.I'm wondering now,If little gal Nelly,Shoemarker is Manoworks lover remembers Joe, her beau,And does she love me like she used to,Down Paradise Row Down Paradise Row
She's,Where's that picture of the fancy football stadium that was wheeled out several years ago? Maybe time to give an updated artists impression of what will be a similar looking SIxfields albeit one with a bigger why the shock several hospitality boxes and a few extra seats. i See the Scots have the correct way of dealing with this like the he invitation to perform the task at a most embarrassing moment.  Roger had been invited to give a talk at the University of numpty.  Just as the hosts were welcoming him as their international speaker, a facsimile was handed, one to the other, and eventually to him, inviting him not to do this role.
I think you know my views on this matter.





 


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« Reply #27176 on: August 15, 2020, 20:40:50 pm »

I think you know my views on this matter.

Crystal clear  Grin Grin Grin 🤯🤯🤯
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« Reply #27177 on: August 18, 2020, 12:00:23 pm »

At the risk of stirring the pot... we're coming up to 4 days since the Trust published their last public letter to KT who responded by reiterating his desire for a conversation with the Trust.

Does anyone know if any dates for that call have been suggested or agreed yet?
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« Reply #27178 on: August 18, 2020, 12:03:09 pm »

The trust do read/post on this forum, so perhaps they can confirm when the scheduled zoom meeting with KT, will be taking place.

If not on here, let the trust members know via email at least! #transparency
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« Reply #27179 on: August 18, 2020, 12:20:29 pm »

At the risk of stirring the pot... we're coming up to 4 days since the Trust published their last public letter to KT who responded by reiterating his desire for a conversation with the Trust.

Does anyone know if any dates for that call have been suggested or agreed yet?

The Trust will no doubt be discussing it with their board and members to work out their next strategic move.
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