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1  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Exeter (A) Tuesday 7th December on: December 07, 2021, 22:07:27 pm
Brilliant win tonight.  Could only listen on the radio but sounded like a great first half and the conditions definitely affected us second half.  Tough to play in those conditions against a side who have clearly had a massive kick up the backside at half time.

Would have been happy to hang on for a draw but what a win.  In terms of results reminds me of the away win at Plymouth when Wilder was in charge.  Potentially massive result and all things considered the management team and players performing way above my expectations at the moment.

Great stuff.
2  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Northampton Town Women on: December 06, 2021, 01:21:36 am
Brilliant result for the Womens team as they continue to break new ground.

Into Round 3 of the Womens FA Cup.  Outstanding achievement.
3  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: December 06, 2021, 00:30:08 am
Nice post Peter, it would be great if we could all put together (and I include the owners) for the good of NTFC.  

I agree the Trust have failed to connect better with the supporter base

If we are signing new players, it doesn't even matter if they are any good

No East stand development (for now)

The football club itself can still be owned and run by KT or whoever.

Nice one I appreciate your honesty.
4  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Question on: December 06, 2021, 00:10:00 am
You spend an unhealthy amount of time thinking about the Trust.

Good luck with your poll.  I genuinely hope you get a positive majority.  If you read my discussion with Grange last night you would understand why the questions is seriously flawed and won't obtain the information/answer I believe you are seeking.

I did suggest GPC amended it but he hasn't and you have well and truly ran with it.  When the answer comes back honestly and legitimately as a simple NO in both instances I hope you have someone that can help you understand why.  There's just no helping some people  Huh?
5  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Question on: December 05, 2021, 21:19:59 pm
however given KTís almost comical monosyllabic answers to the recent 10 questions from the trust I wouldnít have much expectation of a satisfactory answer

I think you should probably ask the Trust whether the questions were asked and answered word for word in the way they have been presented on their latest update.  Or are they supplying an edited precis/summary of the answers they were given?

Quote from Facebook "The Trust however for 8 of the 10 question do precis the view expressed by the chairman."

Just some more of the silly games both sides seem to now be playing.
6  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: December 04, 2021, 23:18:03 pm
Why do certain posters on this board think it is all Trust v Club?

I post on here as GrangeParkCobbler, have done since I believe 2007.

Genuine question to other everything I now post tainted by the fact I have been a Trust Board member for the last 10 months, yes 10 months out of a 14 year posting history?

As I put in my earlier post...I posted the facts as GPC, just as I did when Cardoza was in charge. Many many (far too many) did not see what was coming, did not see that anything was wrong until it was too late. I was posting information then and asking questions, just as I am now. It has nothing to do with the Trust.........

I wanted to reply to this one seperately.  I think most people, though definitely not all, are intelligent enough to understand the difference between when you post as a Trust Board Member and a supporter.  I always make sure I state when I want your Trust opinion.

However it's much easier to seperate the two when talking about the playing side than when you are posting on this kind of thread.  The difficulty you have and it's something I've mentioned before is it is very difficult to hear a person like yourself give an opinion on the ownership or redevelopment and not expect that to be the opinion you carry into your work with the Trust.  I don't think there's any way you can get away from that and frankly why would you.  I want you to be honest and I believe you are.

The downside with that of course is there is a feeling of disconnect then with the Trust as someone with a differing opinion feels unrepresented.     

I might not agree with all you say but I appreciate the way you do it and how you come across. The same can be said for Keith on the occasions he posts and from what I have read from Andy and Robert on Facebook they always come across well.

There are others like Random, Legal advisor John, Chris and Stefan who just don't come across well at all and do more harm than good in my opinion.
7  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: December 04, 2021, 22:43:53 pm
Really appreciate your responses GPC and I for one appreciate the level of detail you provide when possible.  I also fully accept that this is your response not that of the Trust and that's all I was asking for.

So really what it seems to boil down to is an unease with the complexity of the business structure and whether we as supporters ethically believe the owners are allowed to sell their share holding for £6+ million and reaquire it essentially for £1+ million having seperately over 7ish years loaned the club the equivalent amount of that initial sale.

Everything else around where the money went, whether they paid the right tax on it etc. is all a little irrelevant in the most part unless there is evidence of serious wrong doing and I haven't seen or been told that there is.

I hate to say this as I know I'm opening myself up for the usual supects to hurl more abuse my way....I don't think we have a right to expect to know how much someone sells their share holding for.  You are not taking that money out of the club that's the shareholders money not the clubs.  The club has no right to it.  So by that token it also applies to the reacquirement.  So in reality that means the amount of profit they made is irrelevant as it's their money not the clubs.

So maybe it's time for everyone to put this specific debate to bed and only raise it again if new evidence is obtained that shows any actual wrong doing.

If there was evidence of taking money that was intended for the club or something illegal had taken place then that would completely alter my view.
8  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: December 04, 2021, 17:57:26 pm
It's you that is implying something of GPC through use of the word seem.
He has either been extremely misleading or he hasn't.
Which is it?

A) I think GPC would have been able to handle this one himself but thanks for your input.

B) I used the word seem as I was giving him the benefit of the doubt that he had simply made a mistake in the way he worded it.  The way it is currently worded is extremely misleading.  Hope that's clear. 

And of course the ultimate irony is that he is a representative of a supporters group that have already asked those exact same questions of KT and been given the answers.  So he could save anyone that's interested time and tell you himself.  Of course you could also ask Tom as well or instead just to be clear.
9  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: December 04, 2021, 17:43:33 pm
Ok, so you accept that the shareholders (David Bower and Kelvin Thomas) received £6.68m for THEIR shares in the parent company of the football club, and then regained those shares by loaning £1.1m of the £6.68m back to the CLUB?

So DB and KT were £5.5m up on the deal, and since it went sour have continued to lend money to the club to keep it running, and it is that money that sits as a debt on the balance sheet of the club, yet if the club went to the wall then the owners "would not be affected financially" to any great extent..... it all adds up now eh?

So we seem to have gone round in circles yet again much as we did two months ago and two months before that.

So let's cut to the chase.  Say we agree on everything you have said, which I would happily do if I was supplied with the supporting evidence obtained by the Trust legal advisor and providing it wasn't obtained through unethical or illegal means.  And we are also willing to accept there may be some missing costs in your calculations.

Am I right in thinking the current owners could have walked away once they completed the sale of their share holding?  Was it a bad thing they reaquired the shares and loaned the club the money?

In summary what is your conclusion regarding the whole Chinese deal and what problems do you have with it?  Do you believe anything illegal has taken place?  And/Or anything unethical?  Do you believe any laws/rules have been broken?  Or is it simply the case that you are unhappy the owners made such a large profit from a private transaction and have only so far been lending instead of gifting that profit to the club with an assumed expectation that it's paid back at some stage?
10  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: December 04, 2021, 17:24:21 pm
So there you go.....if anyone wants to ask Tom Cliffe to ask the questions on behalf of any interested fans..... is it correct that £6.68m came into the club from 5USports for a 100% shareholding in the parent company, and is it correct that they (5U) defaulted on the charge so that the 100% shareholding came back the other way for just over £1.1m?

Sorry GPC but you need to edit this.  It's extremely misleading as you seem to be implying that the £6.68m you alledge was paid for private share holding(s) is the clubs money or should have come to the club.
11  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: player pathway on: December 03, 2021, 17:18:22 pm
A good post.
Scott Pollock could be a typical example of the former, from his on field performances he should be given more opportunity's, however we aren't aware of what is going on behind the scenes.
I hope that he is one of many that doesn't waste his potential and are able to enjoy the opportunitys that they have been provided.

Some good points made.

I really like the look of Pollock but you have to say if it doesn't work for him under Brady then that would say more about the player than the club I feel.

I just can't shake this feeling that if he just got a run of games under his belt he might make it but the management don't seem to have that faith in him.
12  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Injury Updates.... on: December 03, 2021, 17:12:42 pm
i was told Etete would be out for between 2 to 3 weeks on saturday which sounds reasonable with a hamstring injury .

Sad news if true but agreed sounds about right if it wasn't too serious.  Would be silly to rush him in too soon and lose him for longer.

Also agree with the calls about contract extensions for Horsfall, Roberts and Koiki.  Some big players we need to get under contract and soon.  Hopefully we have a few extension clauses written in.
13  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: December 03, 2021, 17:09:13 pm
I have said in an earlier post that I would like to hear what KT has said to the Trust and actually Iím in complete agreement about the Trust should be transparent about their conversations with the club where possible.
We now have our own representation on the board in the form of Tom Cliffe, so irrespective of what the Trust have and havenít said letís get Tom to pop the $64m question to KT about whether he did or didnít retain the monies from the sale of the club to 5U Sport when the shareholding was brought back under KT and DBS control.

Nice one glad we agree.

Keep us all informed on how you get on.

14  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: December 03, 2021, 16:06:06 pm
I detect you might have a chip on your shoulder about the Trust, why donít you give yourself some therapy and address your issues with them, otherwise you might start to come across on here as a bit of a joke.
Tom is exactly the right person to ask this question.

 Grin Grin Grin

Don't be offended but I think you are probably the last person on here to give anyone advice about having a chip on the shoulder.   Grin

The funny thing is I'd have thought you of all people would be backing me 100%.

If everything that you claim about our owners is true then surely by challenging the Trust to provide evidence, release the explanations they were given and detail what happened if/when they reported any of this to the relevant authorities that that would only support and strengthen the case.  If the Trust choose to be selective then the reverse happens.  Why would that be the wrong thing to ask of them?
15  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: December 03, 2021, 14:13:53 pm
No there isn't you're quite right, but then KT has at his own insistence just installed a fans representative to the board of directors who in turn claims to have stood to represent us.
My point was, if enough fans want to know the answer to any particular question then it should be asked of KT by Tom. Whether or not Tom gets an answer to any question is of course entirely KTs prerogative.
I realise KT is at liberty to answer questions from those individuals he deems important enough or is on sufficiently good terms to want to reply to, but do you really think he is going to want to address random questions from the great unwashed such as you or I?
Other than representing the fans officially at board level and acting as a liason officer, what else has that position been created for?

You suggested people should ask Tom....I replied "Go for it nothing stopping anyone from asking the question".  I also offered a potentially better alternative for those who question Tom's independence or trust in any answer he might supply.

You seem to be debating something I never said about asking KT directly though that's also an option that many have taken in the past.

The Trust Board did exactly that.  Surely someone with your curious nature would be interested in what they were told and why they refuse to share that with us over a year later.  Great thing is some of it is written correspondence so you can have even more faith that you are not being given a "version" of what was said.
16  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: December 03, 2021, 11:53:13 am
Given that he's more our Tom than KT's Tom, if enough of us would like that question answering I absolutely think he should.
He does afterall represent us, not just himself.

Go for it.  Nothing stopping anyone from asking the question.

I can offer a better solution, I think, bearing in mind a few of the supporters asking have questioned Tom's independence and would probably struggle to believe any answer if it doesn't align with their own.

There is an independent supporters body called the NTFC Supporters Trust.  They've already asked these questions directly of KT, over a year ago in fact....that was after someone potentially the legal advisor Random mentions had finished hawking the evidence round the press.

So they know the answers and have had written correspondence and face to face meetings with the owner regarding these exact matters.

They didn't tell anyone they had done this till it became public through other sources and have never shared what the answers were despite being asked several times.  In fact they had so many concerns regarding what KT had done and said they buried the hatchet with him and backed the development deal you see on the table today.

Surely that would be the ideal starting point for anyone who wants to know the answers to some of the questions being raised about this matter especially if you value the independence of the Trust and understand they ask these questions on the supporters/members behalf.
17  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: December 02, 2021, 15:50:28 pm
I'm sorry McHammer but this has to be one of the most unintentionally inaccurate and funniest posts ever.

Glad you got the humour....I sense you may have missed the intended irony.   Roll Eyes
18  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: December 02, 2021, 14:03:04 pm
Your not very good at distances are you ? look at Google Earth, half way across the athletics track is less than half the distance to Five Guys and in case you haven't realised Five Guys  isn't a warehouse, some of which can be 30Mts high.

Please tell me you didn't just spend 5 mins on Google Earth working that out  Grin Grin

Hemmed in means that something is prevented from moving or changing due to being surrounded by obstacles.  So technically the South Stand is hemmed in by Walter Tull Way, the North by a bloody big hill and the West by a football pitch.  
19  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: December 02, 2021, 13:39:37 pm
Labour and the Libs donít believe the ďindependent ď report on the land valuation and require a fully validated red book one.
Note the caveat at the start of the valuation letter.

So for clarity can you point me to where Labour and Lib Dems said they don't believe the report.  I also note the quotes around independent. Where has anyone said it is not independent?  I may have missed something that you have read.

My understanding is the report is deemed not of sufficient level/detail for the process hence why the requirement for the red book version.


20  The Hotel End / Cobblers Corner / Re: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever? on: December 02, 2021, 13:32:26 pm
I really don't understand this issue with being 'hemmed in by warehouses'. What would you rather see the land sold for? A lot of stadia are surrounded by industry

It's a phrase people use to portray a negative image in your mind.

I see we are now "hemmed in by Five Guys".
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