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Summer 2021 Transfer Window

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bungle
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« Reply #900 on: June 10, 2021, 19:59:31 pm »

Pretty much spot on here, but I would suggest that the data-based approach is very much still a planned idea at best. KT said already that they aren't looking into hiring a data analyst "yet" - because, you know, why would we rush something like this after a calamitous relegation with poor recruitment at the heart of the issues?

.... His only real career goal spurt came under Brady, so perhaps we should look more to Brady's tactical nous for being able to get goals from a capable midfielder than to Watson being a regular goal threat?


Good points. I have no idea whether these signings will be successful or not but what I was hoping for from KT's rhetoric was that the recruitment process as a whole would be improved.  If it's true that the club haven't found any sort of data analyst yet then it looks to me like that a lot of the talk of a change of process was hot air. From what I've seen all that's changed is a new Head of Recruitment (who we've employed before) and the odd bit of input from Graham Carr - hardly the revolution we were promised.

You make a good point that Watson's purple patch may well have been down to Brady's coaching and capacity to improve a player rather than innate ability. I would say that Brady also improved Horsfall, L. Jones and Marshall amongst others. (It's a shame we've lost Jones because I think unlike Watson he had the potential to develop into a saleable asset like Goode. Still, the improvement in Horsfall was dramatic and I think he could have a very good year in L2 with the right partner alongside him.)

Perhaps we should look on these new signings as 'rough diamonds' that Brady can shape and develop.  




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« Reply #901 on: June 10, 2021, 20:51:34 pm »

Good points. I have no idea whether these signings will be successful or not but what I was hoping for from KT's rhetoric was that the recruitment process as a whole would be improved.  If it's true that the club haven't found any sort of data analyst yet then it looks to me like that a lot of the talk of a change of process was hot air. From what I've seen all that's changed is a new Head of Recruitment (who we've employed before) and the odd bit of input from Graham Carr - hardly the revolution we were promised.

You make a good point that Watson's purple patch may well have been down to Brady's coaching and capacity to improve a player rather than innate ability. I would say that Brady also improved Horsfall, L. Jones and Marshall amongst others. (It's a shame we've lost Jones because I think unlike Watson he had the potential to develop into a saleable asset like Goode. Still, the improvement in Horsfall was dramatic and I think he could have a very good year in L2 with the right partner alongside him.) Perhaps we should look on these new signings as 'rough diamonds' that Brady can shape and develop.

In the surprise signing of Lewis it appears that Richards and Calderwood may have had an input. To me a committee type signing is more practical and this (signing) might be an example as such.

 




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« Reply #902 on: June 10, 2021, 21:04:50 pm »

Interesting - any Lawyers on here who can comment! For a start there must be some mitigating circumstances?

No lawyers needed evers. Just believe it because it's correct.
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« Reply #903 on: June 10, 2021, 22:02:35 pm »

Good points. I have no idea whether these signings will be successful or not but what I was hoping for from KT's rhetoric was that the recruitment process as a whole would be improved.  If it's true that the club haven't found any sort of data analyst yet then it looks to me like that a lot of the talk of a change of process was hot air. From what I've seen all that's changed is a new Head of Recruitment (who we've employed before) and the odd bit of input from Graham Carr - hardly the revolution we were promised.

You make a good point that Watson's purple patch may well have been down to Brady's coaching and capacity to improve a player rather than innate ability. I would say that Brady also improved Horsfall, L. Jones and Marshall amongst others. (It's a shame we've lost Jones because I think unlike Watson he had the potential to develop into a saleable asset like Goode. Still, the improvement in Horsfall was dramatic and I think he could have a very good year in L2 with the right partner alongside him.)

Perhaps we should look on these new signings as 'rough diamonds' that Brady can shape and develop.  





KT in bluff ,bluster and bûllshît, surly not!  data drive approach my arše.
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« Reply #904 on: June 10, 2021, 22:14:25 pm »

Honestly.
If you look at our championship winning team, we didn’t have any World Cup beaters!
Just the right players with the right mentality, that formed a formidable group. 
Most of which weren’t highly regarding by their previous clubs when signing.
They need to create the perfect blend and that can 100% be achieved by buying players who are yet to have shown their full potential.
Have faith in what they are doing, they certainly know a hell of a lot more than you lot!
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« Reply #905 on: June 10, 2021, 22:27:24 pm »

Honestly.
If you look at our championship winning team, we didn’t have any World Cup beaters!
Just the right players with the right mentality, that formed a formidable group. 
Most of which weren’t highly regarding by their previous clubs when signing.
They need to create the perfect blend and that can 100% be achieved by buying players who are yet to have shown their full potential.
Have faith in what they are doing, they certainly know a hell of a lot more than you lot!

Interesting comments - Holmes was the Gem who was our World Beater and proved it on several occasions for example, Luton and Stevenage. Other than that you are probably right. 
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« Reply #906 on: June 10, 2021, 22:48:43 pm »

Honestly.
If you look at our championship winning team, we didn’t have any World Cup beaters!
Just the right players with the right mentality, that formed a formidable group. 
Most of which weren’t highly regarding by their previous clubs when signing.
They need to create the perfect blend and that can 100% be achieved by buying players who are yet to have shown their full potential.
Have faith in what they are doing, they certainly know a hell of a lot more than you lot!

I certainly don't disagree with this - whilst I am sceptical that these changes are anything more than a few extra voices inputting their opinions, I do have full faith in JB and the rest of the guys to bring in the right players for the system they want to play!

From the signings so far and from what JB has said about them, it seems we will play a high tempo style and get the ball into the box often from wide areas. These signings would surely all fit that style well. As you say, an effective yet individually unspectacular team where players fit their intended roles trumps a team of highly paid 'superstars' when there isn't a cogent plan - see Morecambe and Salford respectively this year! As it goes I personally think all 3 new lads look like good players - particularly Pinnock
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« Reply #907 on: June 10, 2021, 22:57:58 pm »

Love the spin, we’ve lost our two best players and replaced them with very average ones by the fans of their old teams comments.
We need a marquee signing, preferably before the shît hits the fan 🤐
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« Reply #908 on: June 10, 2021, 23:05:03 pm »

Whilst a data based approach is a significant tool, as with any decision making process it has its vulnerabilities and limitations. What if the players that score highly refuse to sign? Sometimes you are forced to revert to instinct or even worse taking a player who is halfway down the barrel. Not that I believe we would ever do that?

Like it or not it is often necessary to use a number of strategies to come to a decision including that good old professional instinct. Back to square one then.
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« Reply #909 on: June 10, 2021, 23:10:14 pm »

Just to summarise the last 24 hours and our resulting chit chatting:
1) Well done JB - you set a deadline and stuck to it
2) Welcome to our 2 new midfielders - give your all to NTFC, listen to JB and don’t read this forum!
3) We were never going to show our workings on the data based approach but let’s be clear, it was only ever going to be used to bring unknowns into consideration- our 3 recent signings were all known commodities - right or wrong, that’s the way it’ll work
4) Message to Cambridge fans - you’ve got a good one but he wasn’t always so , be careful!
5) Message to fans of wherever Watson ends up … no great loss. A very average midfielder who scored a few goals in a purple patch where our forwards went 100% AWOL.
6) Still think Mitch looks like Josh low so I’m very excited about that.
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« Reply #910 on: June 10, 2021, 23:52:20 pm »

Love the spin, we’ve lost our two best players and replaced them with very average ones by the fans of their old teams comments.
We need a marquee signing, preferably before the shît hits the fan 🤐

Care to share a couple of names who would you might like to see sign who you would class as a marquee signing? Preferably no former players or players over the age of 31!
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« Reply #911 on: June 11, 2021, 05:24:42 am »

Honestly.
If you look at our championship winning team, we didn’t have any World Cup beaters!
Just the right players with the right mentality, that formed a formidable group....
Have faith in what they are doing, they certainly know a hell of a lot more than you lot!

Disagree. The Championship winning team had a core of quality players with pedigree and a proven-track record: JJOT (16 goals for Bristol Rovers; L1 experience), Rico (proven lower-league goal scorer), Moloney (L1 experience and had played for Forest), Nicky Adams (proven lower league assist king). Later we signed the likes of Collins and Martin on loan.

Recruitment quality matters. By KT’s own admission it wasn’t good enough last year and that’s why we went down. Saying ‘they know a lot more than us so let them get on with it’ is not very helpful. Did you ‘have faith’ in Curle’s recruitment last summer? How did that work out for you? As fans we have the right to scrutinise core processes such as recruitment as it has a massive impact on the quality of the product we pay for. It’s also important that they are held accountable for the promises they make.
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« Reply #912 on: June 11, 2021, 06:20:12 am »

Disagree. The Championship winning team had a core of quality players with pedigree and a proven-track record: JJOT (16 goals for Bristol Rovers; L1 experience), Rico (proven lower-league goal scorer), Moloney (L1 experience and had played for Forest), Nicky Adams (proven lower league assist king). Later we signed the likes of Collins and Martin on loan.

Recruitment quality matters. By KT’s own admission it wasn’t good enough last year and that’s why we went down. Saying ‘they know a lot more than us so let them get on with it’ is not very helpful. Did you ‘have faith’ in Curle’s recruitment last summer? How did that work out for you? As fans we have the right to scrutinise core processes such as recruitment as it has a massive impact on the quality of the product we pay for. It’s also important that they are held accountable for the promises they make.

I still think there's a lot of luck when it comes to recruitment at our level and budget. For example JJOT took a long time to come up with the goods. I suspect it's more that the recruitment was good in hindsight because the team did so well and an automatic response to blame recruitment policy when it  goes badly. It could be that the players brought in are potentially up to the task but it simply doesn't work out. You've got to spend decent money for guaranteed success and you can't say we've done that.
If you remember when the Cardozas first showed up they did splash the cash and it still took a while to lift ourselves out of the L2
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« Reply #913 on: June 11, 2021, 07:06:23 am »

Care to share a couple of names who would you might like to see sign who you would class as a marquee signing? Preferably no former players or players over the age of 31!
Can’t promise not over 31, Neal Eardley released by Burton, Chucks Aneke released by Charlton or Kieran Agard released by MK Dongs.
They all will cost money so none will happen.
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« Reply #914 on: June 11, 2021, 08:07:10 am »

Disagree. The Championship winning team had a core of quality players with pedigree and a proven-track record: JJOT (16 goals for Bristol Rovers; L1 experience), Rico (proven lower-league goal scorer), Moloney (L1 experience and had played for Forest), Nicky Adams (proven lower league assist king). Later we signed the likes of Collins and Martin on loan.

Recruitment quality matters. By KT’s own admission it wasn’t good enough last year and that’s why we went down. Saying ‘they know a lot more than us so let them get on with it’ is not very helpful. Did you ‘have faith’ in Curle’s recruitment last summer? How did that work out for you? As fans we have the right to scrutinise core processes such as recruitment as it has a massive impact on the quality of the product we pay for. It’s also important that they are held accountable for the promises they make.


Sorry at what point did I say recruitment isn’t crucial??
Last years completely different.  I never at any point had any confidence in Curle both on and off the pitch.
Sorry I don’t understand your point?
Just saying there are many players out there that haven’t fully reached their potential or have lost confidence over the years that we can pick up.
You don’t have to have heard of them before!
I’d like to think all players have some ability, they are professional footballers for god sake.
An element of luck you certainly need but the main thing is the players happiness at the club and the feeling of being settled, then you’ll get the best out of them and confidence comes with that.
Just stop the bloody moaning and let’s just get behind the team and the club with what they are doing!
I’m personally very excited and looking forward to the season ahead.
UTC!!

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« Reply #915 on: June 11, 2021, 08:13:53 am »

Remember that season when we signed those top quality players Van Veen, Crooks, Pierre, Turnbull, Bunney, Facey, Grimes and Long?

Oh and had a World famous manager too.

That was a memorable time.
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« Reply #916 on: June 11, 2021, 08:30:05 am »

Disagree. The Championship winning team had a core of quality players with pedigree and a proven-track record: JJOT (16 goals for Bristol Rovers; L1 experience), Rico (proven lower-league goal scorer), Moloney (L1 experience and had played for Forest), Nicky Adams (proven lower league assist king). Later we signed the likes of Collins and Martin on loan.

Recruitment quality matters. By KT’s own admission it wasn’t good enough last year and that’s why we went down. Saying ‘they know a lot more than us so let them get on with it’ is not very helpful. Did you ‘have faith’ in Curle’s recruitment last summer? How did that work out for you? As fans we have the right to scrutinise core processes such as recruitment as it has a massive impact on the quality of the product we pay for. It’s also important that they are held accountable for the promises they make.

Another interesting post on recruitment. JJOT took a long time to bed down with CW seemingly despairing of him ? Rico by 2015 was very much in the twilight of his career. and Adams if truth be known was not always a first X1 team selection. Your comments on Curle's summer selection rings true; yes the fans should take an interest in selection policies but we have no right as you put it. After all we have a choice whether or not to watch the Cobblers; buyer beware. As for the dreaded word 'accountable' - you only have to look at the opinions on here on players/management et al as it ranges from the ridiculous to the sublime! However if you put a sizeable chunk of money into the Club say over £350,000 that might give you the right to question selection policies even playing style!  Opinions on here is the way to go?
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« Reply #917 on: June 11, 2021, 08:32:21 am »

It's all a f***ing gamble at this level. We'll see 5 weeks into the season how the team is, might be great, might be awful, might be mediocore. Until then the speculation is almost as wrong as it is right.

Hailed as good signings last year: Joseph Mills, Luke Racic, Cian Bolger, Benny Ashley-Seal
Met with  Huh? : Missilou, Horsfall, Ricky Korboa
Met with drab enthusiasm : Loyd Jones, Nuttall

So, basically no correlation whatsoever between what we thought of the signings and how they got on.
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« Reply #918 on: June 11, 2021, 08:33:24 am »

Remember that season when we signed those top quality players Van Veen, Crooks, Pierre, Turnbull, Bunney, Facey, Grimes and Long?

Oh and had a World famous manager too.

That was a memorable time.
Yeah we were in L1, imagine if we hadn’t invested we would have been relegated by Christmas.
Not to mention we changed managers etc.
Are you seriously suggesting signing quality players doesn’t work?
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« Reply #919 on: June 11, 2021, 08:34:37 am »

It's all a **** **** at this level. We'll see 5 weeks into the season how the team is, might be great, might be awful, might be mediocore. Until then the speculation is almost as wrong as it is right.

Hailed as good signings last year: Joseph Mills, Luke Racic, Cian Bolger, Benny Ashley-Seal
Met with  Huh? : Missilou, Horsfall, Ricky Korboa
Met with drab enthusiasm : Loyd Jones, Nuttall

So, basically no correlation whatsoever between what we thought of the signings and how they got on.
Benney is the pick of the crop.
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