New Trust statement on club finances

[tcobb]

My reply is aimed at those who just repeat the same "facts" as they see them. If they really think the Club or the owners are/have done something illegal,  then report it. Doesn't matter if these people are the Trust, Trust members or even people who have no connection to the Trust at all.  
Just stop going round in circles regurgitating the same stuff day after day, it's not achieving anything.  Either put your case of wrong doing to the authorities to deal with how they see fit, or just shut up.

[GrangeParkCobbler]

My reply is aimed at those who just repeat the same "facts" as they see them. If they really think the Club or the owners are/have done something illegal,  then report it. Doesn't matter if these people are the Trust, Trust members or even people who have no connection to the Trust at all.  
Just stop going round in circles regurgitating the same stuff day after day, it's not achieving anything.  Either put your case of wrong doing to the authorities to deal with how they see fit, or just shut up.

By the same token then I should have posted nothing about what the Cardozas were doing? It wasn't illegal after all!

[tcobb]

By the same token you can't accuse people of wrong doing with out proof. If you think something  is wrong go to the FA.,EFL, Council, Police etc  and put your case forward, show them your evidence.  If you can't do this, and you whole argument is based on a feeling what the hell are you hoping to achieve ?  it looks to the world that you are trying to undermine the stability at the Club, for what cause, I don't know.

[guest3086]

My reply is aimed at those who just repeat the same "facts" as they see them. If they really think the Club or the owners are/have done something illegal,  then report it. Doesn't matter if these people are the Trust, Trust members or even people who have no connection to the Trust at all.  
Just stop going round in circles regurgitating the same stuff day after day, it's not achieving anything.  Either put your case of wrong doing to the authorities to deal with how they see fit, or just shut up.

Every single thread on here goes round and round in circles, that is the nature of it. Everyone has their opinion and can only repeat it in slightly different ways. 'I can't sleep cos my bed's on fire.'

[GrangeParkCobbler]

By the same token you can't accuse people of wrong doing with out proof. If you think something  is wrong go to the FA.,EFL, Council, Police etc  and put your case forward, show them your evidence.  If you can't do this, and you whole argument is based on a feeling what the hell are you hoping to achieve ?  it looks to the world that you are trying to undermine the stability at the Club, for what cause, I don't know.

Define "wrongdoing"...because your definition might be different to mine. You seem to be coming at this from an "if its legal its ok" perspective. I might be looking at it from a "it may be legal but its morally wrong" perspective.

If you think that receiving £6.68m from a minor Chinese outfit that nobody had heard of is ok, and now loading an amount roughly the same onto the books of Northampton Town FC by way of "director loans" which will presumably be paid back by the sale of Council land leased to another obscure body by the name of Country Developments Northampton Limited is all good then fair play to you!

I personally am sick of the Football Club playing second fiddle to a prospective land deal...... we had that under the Cardoza stewardship, and we have it again now under the expat stewardship.

[tcobb]

So what is your objective in going over it time after time, what end game are you looking at and hoping to achieve? What do you want the owners of Northampton Town FC to do ?

[GrangeParkCobbler]

So what is your objective in going over it time after time, what end game are you looking at and hoping to achieve? What do you want the owners of Northampton Town FC to do ?

Who's gone over it "time after time"? I think i've mentioned it and laid it out like that all of twice.

End game? I just make people aware of the facts and my findings, just as I did in the months leading up to the Cardoza ending. I like that sort of stuff, digging and trying to piece together the evidence.

I'm not naïve enough to think I can personally achieve anything other than the above.

Me personally? I want the owners of Northampton Town FC to sell up and for us to be owned and run by someone who's primary focus is Northampton Town FC, not on the 22 acres of contaminated land that lies next door.

[tcobb]

Do you really think you are setting yourself a reasonable and achievable objective to bring the end result you desire ?

[Manwork04]

Do you really think you are setting yourself a reasonable and achievable objective to bring the end result you desire ?

What else can the trust do?

[tcobb]

Set reasonable and achievable objectives.

[guest3338]

Set reasonable and achievable objectives.

You still happy with carboots then?

[guest49]

I suppose really the Cardozas did nothing illegal either.....they and the council drew up a loan agreement and they kept going to the Council when they wanted to draw down some money....and then the Council gave it to them.

Nothing illegal there!

It probably wasn't illegal. If it was it clearly wasn't that serious to be walking the streets 6 years later. We do love a wrong 'un.

[Melbourne Cobbler]

Belle-de-Jour took the bulk of the payment from 5USports, a sum of £4.342m. Belle-De-Jour, being a British Virgin Islands registered company would pay no tax on this money.
KT and DB each received personally £1.189m for their share of NT Ventures

DB is an expat based in Dubai and as such pays no personal tax income as he meets the criteria to be classed as a tax resident. If he earned money in Dubai but was tax resident in the UK he would have a liability but not the other way round.

KT....well i'm not aware of which country he classes as his residence for tax purposes.

Bottom line is that the bulk of the money went offshore....theres no getting away from that Melly, and as a result it is not liable to taxation. Besides that.....B-D-J has now loaned NTFC the sum of £4.84m (according to the latest filed accounts)...... I wonder where they got that from!

2017 accounts showed no money loaned by BDJ to NTFC  (£0)
2018 accounts showed £2.563m loaned by BDJ to NTFC (£2.563m)
2019 accounts showed £1.745m loaned by BDJ to NTFC (cumulative £4.308m)
2020 accounts showed £532k loaned by BDJ to NTFC (cumulative £4.84m)

  my understanding was that you had to be resident in Dubai for a given period and meet a number of conditions to achieve personal tax free status but possible. Kelvin Thomas would come under US or possibly UK dependant on days residing in each, but would cop for personal liability either way. The fact the money was paid off shore is irrelevant. For example I have to declare my global income. It matters not one jot that the money may have been earned in the UK and stays in a UK bank account and has never seen Australia. It doesn’t matter where that money is, BVI or Timbuktu. Of course I can choose not to declare it, but given there are global transparency agreements between tax offices that’s a massive risk. All it would take would be 5U Sport to make a claim and KT would be screwed. That’s why it doesn’t make any sense to me.

[Terryfenwickatemyhamster]

Well done MC.

What a shame that transparency is in such short supply on all fronts. It’s like choosing which disease you’d like to die from most.

[Melbourne Cobbler]

I should also point out that when any money over a certain amount gets transferred into my AU bank account from overseas there is a vehicle for the banks to report the transaction to the ATO. This is pretty much a global standard and is in place to combat money laundering. This off shore business is painted as some sort of get out of obligation free card but it doesn’t work on a personal basis. If you base a company in a country off shore then you can get around corporation tax liability, but unless you live there on a personal taxation level it’s fairly pointless these days.

[GrangeParkCobbler]

I should also point out that when any money over a certain amount gets transferred into my AU bank account from overseas there is a vehicle for the banks to report the transaction to the ATO. This is pretty much a global standard and is in place to combat money laundering. This off shore business is painted as some sort of get out of obligation free card but it doesn’t work on a personal basis. If you base a company in a country off shore then you can get around corporation tax liability, but unless you live there on a personal taxation level it’s fairly pointless these days.

Do you believe that the same vehicle is in place on the British Virgin Isles? If a large amount of money came in from China who would report it to whom?

BDJ is wholly owned by David Bower.....the vast majority of the 5U money went to him directly or indirectly. Kelvin Thomas is a bit part player.

Still can't work out why the money went to BDJ though as at the time of the sale to 5U Northampton Town FC were majority owned by UK registered Northampton Town Ventures, who in turn were majority owned by UK registered Fantastical Limited.

Fantastical though registered no transactions in any financial year and filed dormant company accounts for the years in which the transactions are reported to have taken place.

[Melbourne Cobbler]

Do you believe that the same vehicle is in place on the British Virgin Isles? If a large amount of money came in from China who would report it to whom?

BDJ is wholly owned by David Bower.....the vast majority of the 5U money went to him directly or indirectly. Kelvin Thomas is a bit part player.

Still can't work out why the money went to BDJ though as at the time of the sale to 5U Northampton Town FC were majority owned by UK registered Northampton Town Ventures, who in turn were majority owned by UK registered Fantastical Limited.

Fantastical though registered no transactions in any financial year and filed dormant company accounts for the years in which the transactions are reported to have taken place.

The point is GPC is that what goes on in the BVI is irrelevant. I have a legal obligation to declare global income on a personal level and if I don’t I am guilty of tax evasion. In my case if I subsequently transfer the money into my AU bank account then that is automatically reported to the ATO. They will then want to know where it came from and when I received it, and I better be squeaky clean. Additionally the ATO are free to contact the HMRC and due to the transparency agreement they will be told everything. My view is that in their shoes I would also be living with the risk that 5U Sport go public and I may be sitting there with an income I haven’t declared. I am then in the position of being on what has been described to me as "the roller coaster in hell". What you are saying is all possible GPC, I am just pointing out the flaws and risks as I see it with some of the claims. I also find it particularly annoying as from personal experience I know what a crock of sh1t these theories about dodging tax liability between countries can be.

[1971cobbler]

Do you believe that the same vehicle is in place on the British Virgin Isles? If a large amount of money came in from China who would report it to whom?

BDJ is wholly owned by David Bower.....the vast majority of the 5U money went to him directly or indirectly. Kelvin Thomas is a bit part player.

Still can't work out why the money went to BDJ though as at the time of the sale to 5U Northampton Town FC were majority owned by UK registered Northampton Town Ventures, who in turn were majority owned by UK registered Fantastical Limited.

Fantastical though registered no transactions in any financial year and filed dormant company accounts for the years in which the transactions are reported to have taken place.

GPC, it looks like you have got some very specific information to hand, and are concerned about how the monies have been received and moved around.

Report it to the HMRC and let them get on with investigating it if they see fit. Morally, your compass will then hopefully be reset. You will have done your job.

The chips will fall where they deserve to land, I'm sure.

[guest3086]

  my understanding was that you had to be resident in Dubai for a given period and meet a number of conditions to achieve personal tax free status but possible. Kelvin Thomas would come under US or possibly UK dependant on days residing in each, but would cop for personal liability either way. The fact the money was paid off shore is irrelevant. For example I have to declare my global income. It matters not one jot that the money may have been earned in the UK and stays in a UK bank account and has never seen Australia. It doesn’t matter where that money is, BVI or Timbuktu. Of course I can choose not to declare it, but given there are global transparency agreements between tax offices that’s a massive risk. All it would take would be 5U Sport to make a claim and KT would be screwed. That’s why it doesn’t make any sense to me.

For someone who purports to be an international ty**** and cannot miss an opportunity to broadcast the fact, you really are quite dim. I guess your your Kojee Bear piggybank must be empty.

[guest3338]

  my understanding was that you had to be resident in Dubai for a given period and meet a number of conditions to achieve personal tax free status but possible. Kelvin Thomas would come under US or possibly UK dependant on days residing in each, but would cop for personal liability either way. The fact the money was paid off shore is irrelevant. For example I have to declare my global income. It matters not one jot that the money may have been earned in the UK and stays in a UK bank account and has never seen Australia. It doesn’t matter where that money is, BVI or Timbuktu. Of course I can choose not to declare it, but given there are global transparency agreements between tax offices that’s a massive risk. All it would take would be 5U Sport to make a claim and KT would be screwed. That’s why it doesn’t make any sense to me.

Wonder how long DB has been in Dubai and what his residency status is? From what you suggest, that will make quite a large difference to the overall picture.