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New Trust statement on club finances

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BackOfTheNet
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« Reply #740 on: August 31, 2021, 06:31:55 am »

Why are you ridiculing people who my not think the same as you Shoemender ? I'm a season ticket holder and I wouldn't give a penny to a fan owned Club, my choice.

Ditto.
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Manwork04
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« Reply #741 on: August 31, 2021, 08:51:18 am »

I would but it would be as a last resort, it would be a disaster at the moment, we need investment from a chairman who is interested in the club.
A better idea would be to invest in the ground infrastructure, fund the top tier for the north and south.
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Rule Britannia
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« Reply #742 on: August 31, 2021, 09:39:20 am »

Why are you ridiculing people who my not think the same as you Shoemender ? I'm a season ticket holder and I wouldn't give a penny to a fan owned Club, my choice.

Sorry if it sounded like that. I'm not ridiculing anyone, merely suggesting that we have some fans that are happy to accept mediocrity. It's obvious something needs to change and a fan owned club certainly divides opinion. What about Mannys idea about the ground, would people be prepared to pledge money towards that?
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west stand oap
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« Reply #743 on: August 31, 2021, 09:49:27 am »

At the moment a top tier for the north and south would remain empty as we only get crowds of about 5000. The question is do you expand now or when you have a successful team that needs the extra capacity?. We rarely had sell out crowds in division 1 but their was a handful of clubs that would have brought bigger away followings if they were allocated more tickets.
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« Reply #744 on: August 31, 2021, 10:17:46 am »

Sorry if it sounded like that. I'm not ridiculing anyone, merely suggesting that we have some fans that are happy to accept mediocrity. It's obvious something needs to change and a fan owned club certainly divides opinion. What about Mannys idea about the ground, would people be prepared to pledge money towards that?
Not wanting to jeopardies the club (in my opinion) through fan ownership isnt accepting mediocrity.
Funding a stand, or safe standing no. I am interesting the fan village concept and would help fund that to attract more people to the stadium
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« Reply #745 on: August 31, 2021, 10:24:59 am »

At the moment a top tier for the north and south would remain empty as we only get crowds of about 5000. The question is do you expand now or when you have a successful team that needs the extra capacity?. We rarely had sell out crowds in division 1 but their was a handful of clubs that would have brought bigger away followings if they were allocated more tickets.
Build it and they will come…….. now who said that?
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Rule Britannia
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« Reply #746 on: August 31, 2021, 10:43:37 am »

Why are you ridiculing people who my not think the same as you Shoemender ? I'm a season ticket holder and I wouldn't give a penny to a fan owned Club, my choice.

Whilst I don't believe fan ownership to be the best viable option for ourselves, it can work. Although I'm not sure that Hearts 'fan ownership, but not fan management, will thus become a reality' model is the way to go. I may be reading things wrong, but it looks as though a small group of people will look to retain control at Hearts.

If the scheme ever was implemented at NTFC, then I'd prefer a 'one, fan, one share, one vote' model. Let's say that you had the option of investing £60 pounds a year (as a minimum) into being an 'owner' of NTFC. People could invest £60 or £600 or £6000, it wouldn't matter, because only £1 of any one payment would go towards purchasing a share in NTFC - the rest of the money would go towards the club's running costs.

Fans that choose to invest more could do so, but they wouldn't have anymore claim to owning the club than someone who only invested the minimum pledge. Each fan registered as an owner would have/receive exactly the same benefits as the person next to them; ie, one fan, one vote when it comes to electing board members etc during a (let's say) bi-yearly election. There could be other benefits, such as discount cards etc, but still equally applicable to all who have bought into the 'shared ownership' model.

Don't get me wrong, no fan ownership scheme is completely ideal, and in certain instances a club will always need some financial big hitters - take this last eighteen months as an example of how things can suddenly turn pear shaped. But, given the implementation of any new ownership model, I believe something like this would be the best option for bringing Northamptonians on board.
There are a lot of people who would be willing to invest on a yearly basis if they could genuinily claim to be a 'joint owner' of NTFC. Would you ever consider investing in something like this, tcobb?
« Last Edit: August 31, 2021, 10:46:07 am by JollyCobbler » Report Spam   Logged
guest3359
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« Reply #747 on: August 31, 2021, 11:46:21 am »

Build it and they will come…….. now who said that?
No one  Wink
Its one of the most common examples of the Mandela effect
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guest49
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« Reply #748 on: August 31, 2021, 12:18:47 pm »

Build it and they will come…….. now who said that?

Isn't it a misquote from Field of Dreams? I'd rather be watching baseball a lot of the time.  Tongue
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Shoemender
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« Reply #749 on: August 31, 2021, 12:27:09 pm »

Whilst I don't believe fan ownership to be the best viable option for ourselves, it can work. Although I'm not sure that Hearts 'fan ownership, but not fan management, will thus become a reality' model is the way to go. I may be reading things wrong, but it looks as though a small group of people will look to retain control at Hearts.

If the scheme ever was implemented at NTFC, then I'd prefer a 'one, fan, one share, one vote' model. Let's say that you had the option of investing £60 pounds a year (as a minimum) into being an 'owner' of NTFC. People could invest £60 or £600 or £6000, it wouldn't matter, because only £1 of any one payment would go towards purchasing a share in NTFC - the rest of the money would go towards the club's running costs.

Fans that choose to invest more could do so, but they wouldn't have anymore claim to owning the club than someone who only invested the minimum pledge. Each fan registered as an owner would have/receive exactly the same benefits as the person next to them; ie, one fan, one vote when it comes to electing board members etc during a (let's say) bi-yearly election. There could be other benefits, such as discount cards etc, but still equally applicable to all who have bought into the 'shared ownership' model.

Don't get me wrong, no fan ownership scheme is completely ideal, and in certain instances a club will always need some financial big hitters - take this last eighteen months as an example of how things can suddenly turn pear shaped. But, given the implementation of any new ownership model, I believe something like this would be the best option for bringing Northamptonians on board.
There are a lot of people who would be willing to invest on a yearly basis if they could genuinily claim to be a 'joint owner' of NTFC. Would you ever consider investing in something like this, tcobb?


Good post Jolly. this is much more along the lines of what I would like to see, only a lot better put. With the correct management and implementation it could be a way forward, just not sure we'd get enough people on board unfortunately, but we'll never know unless we try.
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« Reply #750 on: August 31, 2021, 12:32:29 pm »

You're off your heads if you think we could raise millions as fans.

When the club was going out of business we barely raised anything as fans.
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Shoemender
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« Reply #751 on: August 31, 2021, 12:44:55 pm »

You're off your heads if you think we could raise millions as fans.

When the club was going out of business we barely raised anything as fans.

And that is why, without a rich benefactor, we'll always be where we've been for over 50 years or worse.
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« Reply #752 on: August 31, 2021, 13:46:50 pm »

Hearts owner gives shares to Hearts foundation.
Today, Heart of Midlothian officially becomes the biggest fan-owned club in British football

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/58385733

Around 8,000 supporters make monthly pledges to the group with them officially taking ownership on Monday.

Do we have 8K willing to match the level of the £10 Million they put into the club and ground.

Impossible to tell what we could raise but hats off to Hearts, they clearly have developed some great momentum.
Simple maths suggests we would struggle to raise anywhere near that level of funding:

- They have given £10m over 7 years. That would be 5,000 people giving £285 each per year.
- 5,000 giving £10 a month would represent just under £1m a year

Their 8,000 giving an average of £20 a month would generate £2m a year.

We'd be better off attracting a consortium of local businesses that could put in regular amounts.

Whatever the ultimate outcome at Hearts it must drive far greater fan engagement and passion for their club.
I personally just don't think we have that in our support in enough numbers, although I'm sure we have plenty of followers with a few quid.
We'll see if we ever get the over priced exec boxes.
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« Reply #753 on: August 31, 2021, 14:01:08 pm »

Impossible to tell what we could raise but hats off to Hearts, they clearly have developed some great momentum.
Simple maths suggests we would struggle to raise anywhere near that level of funding:

- They have given £10m over 7 years. That would be 5,000 people giving £285 each per year.
- 5,000 giving £10 a month would represent just under £1m a year

Their 8,000 giving an average of £20 a month would generate £2m a year.

We'd be better off attracting a consortium of local businesses that could put in regular amounts.

Whatever the ultimate outcome at Hearts it must drive far greater fan engagement and passion for their club.
I personally just don't think we have that in our support in enough numbers, although I'm sure we have plenty of followers with a few quid.
We'll see if we ever get the over priced exec boxes.

Another thing with Hearts is that all their fans support Hearts and only Hearts, I'd be very surprised if any support Celtic/Rangers.
Probably half ours have prem teams so Hearts fans hearts, excuse the pun, are a lot more in it than than a lot of our fans. That's the sad reality and why it's unlikely to happen.
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JollyCobbler
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« Reply #754 on: August 31, 2021, 14:44:32 pm »

You're off your heads if you think we could raise millions as fans.

When the club was going out of business we barely raised anything as fans.

Who mentioned millions? ...other than you?
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guest3355
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« Reply #755 on: August 31, 2021, 14:49:33 pm »

Who mentioned millions? ...other than you?

I mean, Shoemender did literally a few posts back. It's okay though, I know it can be difficult to read.
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Carton Lid
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« Reply #756 on: August 31, 2021, 16:28:30 pm »

Impossible to tell what we could raise but hats off to Hearts, they clearly have developed some great momentum.
Whatever the ultimate outcome at Hearts it must drive far greater fan engagement and passion for their club.
I personally just don't think we have that in our support in enough numbers, although I'm sure we have plenty of followers with a few quid.
We'll see if we ever get the over priced exec boxes.
I think we should look a little closer to home for a bit of inspiration, lets have a look what Lincoln did to go from 2,000 in the National League to 9000 in League One. I know a successful team is a BIG help but the last few times we've been to Lincoln you couldn't help but notice how much the fans have "Bought into" whatever Lincoln were doing, everyone was so enthusiastic about their club and it seemed a two way thing with the club moving forward.
So why don't NTFC get someone to have a look back at what Lincoln have done and see if we could apply any of it to NTFC. I'm sure they could afford to look, after all the paid someone to go through all the personal tweets and face book posting of people "associated" with the Trust, digging for dirt didn't they ?
       Unfortunately at NTFC, at the moment, there doesn't seem to be much "Pride" in the club, as people have been stating for a while, the ground is looking a bit rundown and we have had no TV's working in Carr's Bar all season, I don't know if they are working on the concourse, but surely it's not too difficult to get that sorted in 2 weeks ? The beer is well over a £1 a pint dearer than the Tavern and with no football on the TV's they will lose custom, but the impression I get is that they are not too worried.
       Also, looking from the outside, it seems the Commercial Department do OK with corporate business's but no one is looking at the average fan. For a start £24 is a ridicules price for League 2 football, we are NOT going to sell out any games unless we are in the battle at the top at the end of the season, so why not sell a "5 game package" for say £90, must be used by Christmas or something similar.
        Let's see a bit of "creative marketing" to try and get the people of the town behind us, mend the broken TV's and windows, any new or returning  fans will want to see a bit of pride and positivity around the club, but at the moment, I don't see too much of it.
         
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« Reply #757 on: August 31, 2021, 17:42:12 pm »

I think we should look a little closer to home for a bit of inspiration, lets have a look what Lincoln did to go from 2,000 in the National League to 9000 in League One. I know a successful team is a BIG help but the last few times we've been to Lincoln you couldn't help but notice how much the fans have "Bought into" whatever Lincoln were doing, everyone was so enthusiastic about their club and it seemed a two way thing with the club moving forward.
So why don't NTFC get someone to have a look back at what Lincoln have done and see if we could apply any of it to NTFC. I'm sure they could afford to look, after all the paid someone to go through all the personal tweets and face book posting of people "associated" with the Trust, digging for dirt didn't they ?
       Unfortunately at NTFC, at the moment, there doesn't seem to be much "Pride" in the club, as people have been stating for a while, the ground is looking a bit rundown and we have had no TV's working in Carr's Bar all season, I don't know if they are working on the concourse, but surely it's not too difficult to get that sorted in 2 weeks ? The beer is well over a £1 a pint dearer than the Tavern and with no football on the TV's they will lose custom, but the impression I get is that they are not too worried.
       Also, looking from the outside, it seems the Commercial Department do OK with corporate business's but no one is looking at the average fan. For a start £24 is a ridicules price for League 2 football, we are NOT going to sell out any games unless we are in the battle at the top at the end of the season, so why not sell a "5 game package" for say £90, must be used by Christmas or something similar.
        Let's see a bit of "creative marketing" to try and get the people of the town behind us, mend the broken TV's and windows, any new or returning  fans will want to see a bit of pride and positivity around the club, but at the moment, I don't see too much of it.
         

It is really difficult and so much working against football clubs these days. I'd say the football on the pitch (to sustain crowds) is as important as anything. There are only so many times someone will part with money to watch dross. How many people don't go for a few seasons and then return to 'feel the magic' only to leave early in some drab encounter, vowing not to return?
Price is definitely another big factor but difficult to find that optimum cost. I'd imagine £24 puts a few off, although I'm sure they've done their sums and not enough to justify say £20.
I've always thought that football has outpriced family spectators, well those with older kids. I could afford it but just couldn't justify paying £64 to attend a game at Sixfields, which is tickets only. Then there is the age old problem of getting 'decent' seats.

They could certainly do with investing some money to 'tart up' the place and the outsourced catering isn't the best. Whilst appreciating that it is difficult to run something once or twice a fortnight there could be earning potential here to do something far better for the punters. Investment in the overall match day experience would definitely help.

Packages are a good idea but practically it still needs someone to commit to multiple games for a decent outlay.

Maybe it's just different times to the 30-40k at Wembley but apathy seems to reign. Maybe it's just cyclical and we are having our late 70's/early 80's moment again?! Not forgetting the other 'big C' that will still be having some impact with people's movements, especially on our demographic!
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JollyCobbler
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« Reply #758 on: September 01, 2021, 13:45:24 pm »

I mean, Shoemender did literally a few posts back. It's okay though, I know it can be difficult to read.

I thought you were replying to my post. But it's okay, carry on wandering... Roll Eyes
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« Reply #759 on: September 01, 2021, 21:35:21 pm »

I thought you were replying to my post. But it's okay, carry on wandering... Roll Eyes

Apologies. Please go back to being Jolly.
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