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Question: Do we as a fan base want Tom Cliff to ask Kelvin Thomas the following, is it correct that £6.68m came into the club from 5USports for a 100% shareholding in the parent company, and is it correct that they (5U) defaulted on the charge so that the 100% shar
Yes - 21 (42.9%)
No - 28 (57.1%)
Total Voters: 41

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« Reply #20 on: December 05, 2021, 20:39:40 pm »

I think you should probably ask the Trust whether the questions were asked and answered word for word in the way they have been presented on their latest update.  Or are they supplying an edited precis/summary of the answers they were given?

Quote from Facebook "The Trust however for 8 of the 10 question do precis the view expressed by the chairman."

Just some more of the silly games both sides seem to now be playing.

The Trust did ask KT for a written reply so that they could publish them for all the fans but it wasn't forthcoming.

To be fair the meeting was over 3 hours long and the answers were given throughout that time, as you can imagine it was very easy to wander of course. Their was a fair bit of frustration from KT regarding the questions, as rightly or wrongly, he felt that the Trust already knew some of the answers or as in the film - My Cousin Vinny "it's a bulls*** question"

Ultimately I think it comes down to trusting in what KT is doing and saying. This is why the Chinese deal, the £4m ringfence, the land grab off the council, the £6m debt with little assets, etc etc all on the back of the DC disaster, is why there is such a distance between the Trust and the club.

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« Reply #21 on: December 05, 2021, 21:11:01 pm »

Where’s the “get a life mate” button?
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« Reply #22 on: December 05, 2021, 22:27:54 pm »

Where’s the “get a life mate” button?
Happy to oblige.

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Were in the pipe 5 by 5.
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« Reply #23 on: December 05, 2021, 22:31:03 pm »

Anyone who answered the question as no, are obviously  scared of the truth.
Why on earth would anyone select to be ignorant of the facts?

Hill top protests are nigh Grin

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« Reply #24 on: December 05, 2021, 23:10:00 pm »

You spend an unhealthy amount of time thinking about the Trust.

Good luck with your poll.  I genuinely hope you get a positive majority.  If you read my discussion with Grange last night you would understand why the questions is seriously flawed and won't obtain the information/answer I believe you are seeking.

I did suggest GPC amended it but he hasn't and you have well and truly ran with it.  When the answer comes back honestly and legitimately as a simple NO in both instances I hope you have someone that can help you understand why.  There's just no helping some people  Huh?
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« Reply #25 on: December 05, 2021, 23:34:00 pm »

You sound like a petulant child 😂

As usual name calling when you have run out of arguments.

So come on brain box tell me where I am wrong.
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« Reply #26 on: December 05, 2021, 23:58:27 pm »

I personally don't believe its Toms place to be selective about what he asks the board. Ultimately he is the supporters representative there to give full and balanced representation of all supporters views regarding their questions and concerns. Therefore if a number of supporters ask a question then ask it, irrespective of his personal views. He's there to represent all supporters, not just the ones he may happen to agree with.   
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« Reply #27 on: December 06, 2021, 05:45:03 am »

Anyone who answered the question as no, are obviously  scared of the truth.
Why on earth would anyone select to be ignorant of the facts?

Hill top protests are nigh Grin



On the contrary, I'd love to know the truth of what went on. That wasn't the question though. I'm grown up enough to recognise that nosiness and entitlement are two different things
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« Reply #28 on: December 06, 2021, 05:57:16 am »

I personally don't believe its Toms place to be selective about what he asks the board. Ultimately he is the supporters representative there to give full and balanced representation of all supporters views regarding their questions and concerns. Therefore if a number of supporters ask a question then ask it, irrespective of his personal views. He's there to represent all supporters, not just the ones he may happen to agree with.   

As much as I agree with your last post on the Redevelopment thread I'm afraid I disagree with this one. Imagine this conversation.

"Morning Kelvin"
"Morning Tom"
"I've been talking to a group of our supporters and they've asked me to settle an argument for them."
"Ok"
"Apparently they were talking at the game the other day and would really like to know if your missus takes it up the wrong 'un."
"What? I can't believe you're asking me that."
"Sorry, I have to represent the views of all supporters whether I agree with them or not so I can't be selective with the questions they send me. "
"That's none of your business and none of their business."
"Sorry Kelvin, I'm going to have to press you for an answer. Some fans want to know."
"Get the f*** out of here, Tom."
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« Reply #29 on: December 06, 2021, 06:32:33 am »

As much as I agree with your last post on the Redevelopment thread I'm afraid I disagree with this one. Imagine this conversation.

"Morning Kelvin"
"Morning Tom"
"I've been talking to a group of our supporters and they've asked me to settle an argument for them."
"Ok"
"Apparently they were talking at the game the other day and would really like to know if your missus takes it up the wrong 'un."
"What? I can't believe you're asking me that."
"Sorry, I have to represent the views of all supporters whether I agree with them or not so I can't be selective with the questions they send me. "
"That's none of your business and none of their business."
"Sorry Kelvin, I'm going to have to press you for an answer. Some fans want to know."
"Get the **** out of here, Tom."

Wow that question has lost something in translation.
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« Reply #30 on: December 06, 2021, 06:57:45 am »

As usual name calling when you have run out of arguments.

So come on brain box tell me where I am wrong.
I’ve tried to explain to you, I think you’ve been in Germany a bit too long and lost the empathy you feel for something you care about.
KT doesn’t have to answer the questions, but it’s a legitimate question.
Transparency has never been his forte, to compare football to a business is naive at best just ask Alan Sugar or the chairman of Feyenoord or even the Oystons at Blackpool.
All of them resigned due to fan pressure some of it very unpleasant.
The problem is you can’t go elsewhere to support your club like you can another business such as Tesco.
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« Reply #31 on: December 06, 2021, 08:15:50 am »

As much as I agree with your last post on the Redevelopment thread I'm afraid I disagree with this one. Imagine this conversation.

"Morning Kelvin"
"Morning Tom"
"I've been talking to a group of our supporters and they've asked me to settle an argument for them."
"Ok"
"Apparently they were talking at the game the other day and would really like to know if your missus takes it up the wrong 'un."
"What? I can't believe you're asking me that."
"Sorry, I have to represent the views of all supporters whether I agree with them or not so I can't be selective with the questions they send me. "
"That's none of your business and none of their business."
"Sorry Kelvin, I'm going to have to press you for an answer. Some fans want to know."
"Get the **** out of here, Tom."
I think that's a rather extreme portrayal of how the events might unfold BOTN. I think his more likely to answer 'that's confidential" and leave it at that although I prefer your version. The point is that Tom is there to represent all supporters. If some want questions asked are we saying that Tom should only asks the questions that he endorses or agrees with whilst ignoring those that are say more questionable in terms of credability? That is a rather slippery slope that may cause issue with a section of the supporters, he's already in the cross hairs. I understand there may be an issue with some of the more ridiculous questions that one supporter may ask in isolation, but if a number ask it then what then? My question would be who decides if it is a valid question, Tom or the supporters he represents. I understand your scepticism but on that basis I think its probably best to ask it. I forgot to mention, was that one of the questions the Trust board put forward, I must have missed it?
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« Reply #32 on: December 06, 2021, 08:54:36 am »

I think that's a rather extreme portrayal of how the events might unfold BOTN. I think his more likely to answer 'that's confidential" and leave it at that although I prefer your version. The point is that Tom is there to represent all supporters. If some want questions asked are we saying that Tom should only asks the questions that he endorses or agrees with whilst ignoring those that are say more questionable in terms of credability? That is a rather slippery slope that may cause issue with a section of the supporters, he's already in the cross hairs. I understand there may be an issue with some of the more ridiculous questions that one supporter may ask in isolation, but if a number ask it then what then? My question would be who decides if it is a valid question, Tom or the supporters he represents. I understand your scepticism but on that basis I think its probably best to ask it. I forgot to mention, was that one of the questions the Trust board put forward, I must have missed it?

 Grin
Of course that was an absurdist example chosen for comic effect but there is a serious point at the heart of it. Some things are personal - be they sexual preferences or individual finances or political allegiances or health issues or whatever. If an individual chooses to share any of this information then that is their prerogative, but to front up and ask the question is both rude and disrespectful. I think Tom has a difficult balance to strike on what he acts upon and what he doesn't, but I also think there's an onus on us as supporters to not try and put him in an unnecessarily awkward position to begin with by asking questions we might like to know the answers to but equally have no right to expect an answer to.
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« Reply #33 on: December 06, 2021, 09:58:27 am »

Some things are personal - be they sexual preferences or individual finances or political allegiances or health issues or whatever. If an individual chooses to share any of this information then that is their prerogative, but to front up and ask the question is both rude and disrespectful. 
The question on here is not in any of those categories, it is about a football club we are all involved with, otherwise we wouldn't be on here.
          I really don't think that Tom needs to worry about what he asks Kelvin, as Kelvin has been here for 6 years and only ever tells you what he wants you to know, having Tom as a director is, 100%, not going to change that, surely people are not naïve  enough to think that he will know everything that goes on at NTFC.
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« Reply #34 on: December 06, 2021, 11:18:56 am »

The question on here is not in any of those categories, it is about a football club we are all involved with, otherwise we wouldn't be on here.


I'm afraid I disagree - it's a question about KT and DB's personal finances. It might be couched in terms of the club, but the information being requested allows people to infer what that meant for the owners personally.
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« Reply #35 on: December 06, 2021, 11:48:04 am »

I'm afraid I disagree - it's a question about KT and DB's personal finances. It might be couched in terms of the club, but the information being requested allows people to infer what that meant for the owners personally.
And this is one of the reasons why football in general is a basket case in terms of finances.
Unscrupulous owners ( not saying ours are) can come into football clubs asset strip them and fold the club (Bury) and then have zero transparency because it’s private.
If they wanted privacy I don’t think buying a football club was a great choice.
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« Reply #36 on: December 06, 2021, 12:30:56 pm »

I'm afraid I disagree - it's a question about KT and DB's personal finances. It might be couched in terms of the club, but the information being requested allows people to infer what that meant for the owners personally.
Well I'll disagree again, Surely Personal finances does not include your work and Kelvin's job is to be our managing director. I used to run my own company and my business and personal finances were always kept apart
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« Reply #37 on: December 06, 2021, 12:38:21 pm »

Well I'll disagree again, Surely Personal finances does not include your work and Kelvin's job is to be our managing director. I used to run my own company and my business and personal finances were always kept apart
But KT and DB sold THEIR shares in the club and then reaquired THEIR shares. Presumably when you wound down/sold your company any revenues became your personal finances, right?
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« Reply #38 on: December 06, 2021, 12:55:41 pm »

We could keep going forever on this, but, the shares that he sold were for the business weren't they ? So in my eyes, that makes it a business deal, but you obviously disagree, so I think we are better agreeing to disagree.
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« Reply #39 on: December 06, 2021, 17:33:35 pm »

As much as I agree with your last post on the Redevelopment thread I'm afraid I disagree with this one. Imagine this conversation.

"Morning Kelvin"
"Morning Tom"
"I've been talking to a group of our supporters and they've asked me to settle an argument for them."
"Ok"
"Apparently they were talking at the game the other day and would really like to know if your missus takes it up the wrong 'un."
"What? I can't believe you're asking me that."
"Sorry, I have to represent the views of all supporters whether I agree with them or not so I can't be selective with the questions they send me. "
"That's none of your business and none of their business."
"Sorry Kelvin, I'm going to have to press you for an answer. Some fans want to know."
"Get the **** out of here, Tom."

If I was Kelvyn that would be my answer as well. Nobody, not one person, can prove any impropriety. You can point the finger regarding whether or no there is a moral quandary. But that bridge has been crossed a thousand times by the sanctimonious types on here and their cronies. It all smacks of desperation and good old fashioned jealousy…
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