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Redevelopment Closer Than Ever?

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Author Topic: Redevelopment Closer Than Ever?  (Read 1185534 times)
SadOldGit
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« Reply #29140 on: August 23, 2021, 21:04:54 pm »

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-northamptonshire-58283529
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SadOldGit
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« Reply #29141 on: August 23, 2021, 21:43:49 pm »

Macca, Grossman and their croniesÖhorrible, dirty, bent little c***s.

Scum is the word you need.
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« Reply #29142 on: August 23, 2021, 22:10:31 pm »

Scum is the word you need.

Exactly right. Typical that the "little" men are the ones that get done and the main men/ horrible bŚstards are likely to get off scot free. What's new?
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« Reply #29143 on: September 03, 2021, 09:44:05 am »

Was concerned that this thread nearly fell off the front page. It will never die!

So did Christine Cardoza complete sale of all the properties with claims/charges from NBC against them? It wasnít just Church Brampton.

Following the presentation the other month I believe it was due for further discussion at WNCC cabinet but donít recall when this was scheduled for. Anyone remember?
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I think someone should just take this city of Peterborough and just... just flush it down the f***in' toilet
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« Reply #29144 on: September 03, 2021, 21:16:50 pm »

The club is up for sale. The club is up for sale. E. I. Add E O, the club is up for sale.
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« Reply #29145 on: September 04, 2021, 20:51:54 pm »

The club is up for sale. The club is up for sale. E. I. Add E O, the club is up for sale.

How much?
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« Reply #29146 on: September 05, 2021, 05:50:53 am »

The club is up for sale. The club is up for sale. E. I. Add E O, the club is up for sale.

EVERY club is up for sale!!!

If somebody or fans group wants it go and negotiate and put money where your mouth is!
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« Reply #29147 on: September 05, 2021, 09:04:16 am »

EVERY club is up for sale!!!

If somebody or fans group wants it go and negotiate and put money where your mouth is!

Fcuking hellÖ Heíd need some serious wad to fill that gapÖ
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« Reply #29148 on: September 07, 2021, 22:30:10 pm »

From twitter...

Four members of the Trust's board met with representatives of West Northants Council @WestNorthants this evening to express our concerns about the potential Sixfields stand and land deal.  We would like to thank the councillors for their time.  Details to follow soon. #ntfc
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« Reply #29149 on: September 08, 2021, 08:19:00 am »

The Supporters Trust met with West Northamptonshire Council last night to express their concerns about the Sixfields land and stand deal.
The Trust remains far from convinced that the proposed deal is in the best long-term interests of the football club.
From the little information we have, it appears that the deal best serves the short-term interests of its overseas owners, David Bower and Kelvin Thomas.
The Trust fears that the proposed deal will see any football club profits wiped out by the loan repaid to the owners, leaving the club with minimal investment benefit, no cash in the bank and no land asset.
The Trust told the meeting that any deal represented a very rare opportunity to finally move the football club, and the town of Northampton, forward.
And we have asked the council to consider a partnership approach towards bringing forward an infrastructure foundation through which Cobblers fans, the club's owners and the local authority could invest monies and expertise to uplift the fortunes of the football club off the field as much as on it.
The prevailing lack of transparency around the current deal chimes alarmingly with the situation seven years ago, when millions of pounds of public money vanished on what was then Northampton Borough Council's watch.
The Trust would support and welcome any owner of the football club who clearly and openly demonstrates that he or she has the club's best long-term interests at heart.
With regard to the incompleted East Stand, does £3 million really equate to value for money when it adds just 200 more seats, 18 executive boxes and some lounges?
Why do the present development plans include building a logistics shed on the club's historic land footprint behind the East Stand which is protected as an Asset of Community Value?
Do we not now not have a great chance to finally realise the potential of Sixfields stadium and build something much more impressive to benefit both the football club and the local community?
Do we really have to have an industrial unit virtually up against the back of the East Stand?
Why can't that land be appointed for say practice pitches, a training ground, an athletics or other community sport facility?
Or a hotel, a conference centre, a fanzone - something with community benefit and income potential?
Why another featureless unit to go alongside the others earmarked for the rest of the development site?
Northampton's sports teams are great assets for the town - they should be nurtured and valued and encouraged to help make the town the best it can be.
The town's local plan is as much about maximising a health and wellbeing strategy as it is about economic development.
So many other football clubs are benefiting from progressive partnership working.
Coventry, Leicester, Peterborough, Milton Keynes and Luton are all within a 50-mile radius of Northampton - and they are leaving Northampton behind.
For the largest town in the country this cannot be seen as acceptable.
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Manwork04
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« Reply #29150 on: September 08, 2021, 08:28:05 am »

The Supporters Trust met with West Northamptonshire Council last night to express their concerns about the Sixfields land and stand deal.
The Trust remains far from convinced that the proposed deal is in the best long-term interests of the football club.
From the little information we have, it appears that the deal best serves the short-term interests of its overseas owners, David Bower and Kelvin Thomas.
The Trust fears that the proposed deal will see any football club profits wiped out by the loan repaid to the owners, leaving the club with minimal investment benefit, no cash in the bank and no land asset.
The Trust told the meeting that any deal represented a very rare opportunity to finally move the football club, and the town of Northampton, forward.
And we have asked the council to consider a partnership approach towards bringing forward an infrastructure foundation through which Cobblers fans, the club's owners and the local authority could invest monies and expertise to uplift the fortunes of the football club off the field as much as on it.
The prevailing lack of transparency around the current deal chimes alarmingly with the situation seven years ago, when millions of pounds of public money vanished on what was then Northampton Borough Council's watch.
The Trust would support and welcome any owner of the football club who clearly and openly demonstrates that he or she has the club's best long-term interests at heart.
With regard to the incompleted East Stand, does £3 million really equate to value for money when it adds just 200 more seats, 18 executive boxes and some lounges?
Why do the present development plans include building a logistics shed on the club's historic land footprint behind the East Stand which is protected as an Asset of Community Value?
Do we not now not have a great chance to finally realise the potential of Sixfields stadium and build something much more impressive to benefit both the football club and the local community?
Do we really have to have an industrial unit virtually up against the back of the East Stand?
Why can't that land be appointed for say practice pitches, a training ground, an athletics or other community sport facility?
Or a hotel, a conference centre, a fanzone - something with community benefit and income potential?
Why another featureless unit to go alongside the others earmarked for the rest of the development site?
Northampton's sports teams are great assets for the town - they should be nurtured and valued and encouraged to help make the town the best it can be.
The town's local plan is as much about maximising a health and wellbeing strategy as it is about economic development.
So many other football clubs are benefiting from progressive partnership working.
Coventry, Leicester, Peterborough, Milton Keynes and Luton are all within a 50-mile radius of Northampton - and they are leaving Northampton behind.
For the largest town in the country this cannot be seen as acceptable.
Absolutely Fantastic, the Trust doing what they were created for, great stuff.
Fingers crossed the council listen.
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Rule Britannia
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« Reply #29151 on: September 08, 2021, 08:45:41 am »

Absolutely Fantastic, the Trust doing what they were created for, great stuff.
Fingers crossed the council listen.

Of course all good stuff and Iím sure the council will listen  - but then what?

Great ideas which Iím sure all fans would support but somewhat thin on any tangible business plan - unfortunately the council have been badly stung by NTFC and without alternative (not KT and DB) financial backing why would they support the Trustís suggestion. The trust state they would welcome financial support by an owner who had the interests of the club at heart - thereby firmly nailing their colours to the mast re the current owners but (1) was there any consultation with members on this thinly veiled attack on the current owners and (2) where are these new owners with the trusts presumed approval.
I have a bad feeling that the combination of KTís self interest, the council wishing to appeal to the wider Northamptonshire council tax payer and the Trustís wishful thinking will end up badly for the club - I truly wish I had an alternative and of course itís easy to criticise but surely the Trust should be spending more energy trying to work with the current owners rather than being divisive  - or is it now a case of a battle of egos, and in which case our football club will be the loser.
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« Reply #29152 on: September 08, 2021, 08:58:55 am »

The Supporters Trust met with West Northamptonshire Council last night to express their concerns about the Sixfields land and stand deal.
The Trust remains far from convinced that the proposed deal is in the best long-term interests of the football club.
From the little information we have, it appears that the deal best serves the short-term interests of its overseas owners, David Bower and Kelvin Thomas.
The Trust fears that the proposed deal will see any football club profits wiped out by the loan repaid to the owners, leaving the club with minimal investment benefit, no cash in the bank and no land asset.
The Trust told the meeting that any deal represented a very rare opportunity to finally move the football club, and the town of Northampton, forward.
And we have asked the council to consider a partnership approach towards bringing forward an infrastructure foundation through which Cobblers fans, the club's owners and the local authority could invest monies and expertise to uplift the fortunes of the football club off the field as much as on it.
The prevailing lack of transparency around the current deal chimes alarmingly with the situation seven years ago, when millions of pounds of public money vanished on what was then Northampton Borough Council's watch.
The Trust would support and welcome any owner of the football club who clearly and openly demonstrates that he or she has the club's best long-term interests at heart.
With regard to the incompleted East Stand, does £3 million really equate to value for money when it adds just 200 more seats, 18 executive boxes and some lounges?
Why do the present development plans include building a logistics shed on the club's historic land footprint behind the East Stand which is protected as an Asset of Community Value?
Do we not now not have a great chance to finally realise the potential of Sixfields stadium and build something much more impressive to benefit both the football club and the local community?
Do we really have to have an industrial unit virtually up against the back of the East Stand?
Why can't that land be appointed for say practice pitches, a training ground, an athletics or other community sport facility?
Or a hotel, a conference centre, a fanzone - something with community benefit and income potential?
Why another featureless unit to go alongside the others earmarked for the rest of the development site?
Northampton's sports teams are great assets for the town - they should be nurtured and valued and encouraged to help make the town the best it can be.
The town's local plan is as much about maximising a health and wellbeing strategy as it is about economic development.
So many other football clubs are benefiting from progressive partnership working.
Coventry, Leicester, Peterborough, Milton Keynes and Luton are all within a 50-mile radius of Northampton - and they are leaving Northampton behind.
For the largest town in the country this cannot be seen as acceptable.

Here here! Good stuff from the Trust. Awaiting the latest installment from the KT/DB spin machine now...
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« Reply #29153 on: September 08, 2021, 09:31:12 am »

Don't you think The Trust HAVE tried to communicate and work closely with KT over the last 6 years Cobblerswatch?

KT has history with Supporters Trusts, at both Oxford and Torquay, and now here.

It is also a two way thing isn't it? How many times has KT offered an olive branch ? 

Some seem to forget the Trust are supporters of the club, they want it to thrive.

I expect KT suffers a little from following on from DC in which we have now had 10 years of development focussed owners, why little else changes and certainly doesn't improve.

The business plan would be for local professional people to being involved in the running the club at board level, with a focus on community and greater investment from a wider base, like other clubs have done.

Lets face it, KT has no ambition for our football club, some supporters want more and are now prepared to start pushing for better, starting with the land deal.
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« Reply #29154 on: September 08, 2021, 09:43:03 am »

It's fine to challenge but not it lacks concrete data, maybe due to transparency issues.

"The Trust fears that the proposed deal will see any football club profits wiped out by the loan repaid to the owners, leaving the club with minimal investment benefit, no cash in the bank and no land asset."

There has to be an expectation that the owners get their money back and some profit. Whatever has happened to lead us being millions in debt has happened. What is the quantified "minimal investment benefit" or is it a "fear". Is it a "fear" that whatever money is involved (£5m, £10m, £20m, £50m) will be pocketed by the owners?
I'd agree with the lack of transparency but that falls both on the owners and the council.

Let's have a transparent deal so we can see who is having what and if conversation gets bogged down about a shed then we all know nothing will ever get built, not in most of our lifetimes anyway.
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All he had to do was build a stand.
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« Reply #29155 on: September 08, 2021, 09:56:33 am »

Hi Tone,  Do you think that the owners should get all their money back that they have badly spent on the back of delivering such poor value for money?

Do you think it is acceptable that NTFC loses valuable land asset just so the owners can get their money (which they already have from the Chinese deal) back and make a profit on basically asset stripping?

Its not our fault that we are again almost £7m in debt with nothing to show for it. That is mainly on the owners.

If the club or infrastructure had been improved, then there is a better case, but in 6 years the only thing that has changed is the debt has risen from £500k to approx £7m.

That is why the owners should not expect to walk away having recovered their monies and profit, without leaving NTFC in far better position with a positive future. That is possible but it's going to take compromise, ambition and effort.

If the land deal is going to bring a windfall then the Owners, NTFC and WNC should perhaps have an equal share

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« Reply #29156 on: September 08, 2021, 10:40:42 am »

Don't you think The Trust HAVE tried to communicate and work closely with KT over the last 6 years Cobblerswatch?

KT has history with Supporters Trusts, at both Oxford and Torquay, and now here.

It is also a two way thing isn't it? How many times has KT offered an olive branch ? 

Some seem to forget the Trust are supporters of the club, they want it to thrive.

I expect KT suffers a little from following on from DC in which we have now had 10 years of development focussed owners, why little else changes and certainly doesn't improve.

The business plan would be for local professional people to being involved in the running the club at board level, with a focus on community and greater investment from a wider base, like other clubs have done.

Lets face it, KT has no ambition for our football club, some supporters want more and are now prepared to start pushing for better, starting with the land deal.

Random - I don't want to get into a pissing contest on this and I absolutely agree with the proposal concept - what I'm very concerned about is the means to actually accomplish it - in the decades of me following the club the only people interested in "owning" the club have be "developers" or local businessmen whose pockets have never been deep enough to progress the club - from a love of the club I would always choose the latter but their track record is no better than that of "developers" - in fact they were more often the club's stewards when we face re-election issues at the bottom of the lowest divisions. There is continues talk about local businesspeople - who are they, what gross contributions would be needed to make the plan viable. Even a draft proposal on a fan bond scheme - all of this would add substance to the Trust's statement and indeed make the council more willing to invest in the concept. Can you not see the parallel of when you all take the **** at KT wheeling out out development plans (good or bad) and the trust's concept - neither are going to happen just because the words are spoken
As to your question of the Trust trying to engage with the owners I honestly don't know how hard - there is of course the well publicised refusal to engage in a zoom call and then pushing out divisive statement  but I'm in fairness I'm sure KT is equally to blame for this overall impasse - but the point here it doesn't matter who is most to blame and whilst people continue to score points nothing will happen.

As I've already said I don't have a good answer to this situation but I remain concerned that the current trust action could potentially do more harm than good
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« Reply #29157 on: September 08, 2021, 10:46:04 am »

I'm with you on this one CW. The longer this drags on, the more the club will be in debt to DB/KT. At some point they will see that they are throwing good money after bad and walk, but not without every penny they can recover so it will be goodbye Cobblers hello phoenix club. From my perspective on this the Trust are doing more harm than good.
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« Reply #29158 on: September 08, 2021, 10:52:19 am »

Of course all good stuff and Iím sure the council will listen  - but then what?

Great ideas which Iím sure all fans would support but somewhat thin on any tangible business plan - unfortunately the council have been badly stung by NTFC and without alternative (not KT and DB) financial backing why would they support the Trustís suggestion. The trust state they would welcome financial support by an owner who had the interests of the club at heart - thereby firmly nailing their colours to the mast re the current owners but (1) was there any consultation with members on this thinly veiled attack on the current owners and (2) where are these new owners with the trusts presumed approval.
I have a bad feeling that the combination of KTís self interest, the council wishing to appeal to the wider Northamptonshire council tax payer and the Trustís wishful thinking will end up badly for the club - I truly wish I had an alternative and of course itís easy to criticise but surely the Trust should be spending more energy trying to work with the current owners rather than being divisive  - or is it now a case of a battle of egos, and in which case our football club will be the loser.

Well said. Where are the business cases that justify the Trusts alternative suggestions for land usage? Where is the evidence that there's sufficient/any interest from fans in investing in an "infrastructure foundation"?

More pie in the sky idealism with no substance that will do no more than drive a wedge further between the club and the Trust while simultaneously throwing a spanner into the negotiations between the club and the council.
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« Reply #29159 on: September 08, 2021, 11:12:14 am »

There we go, didn't take long for "pie in the sky" to come out

You do realise how badly we are doing as a football club ?

You do realise lots of other clubs are doing so much better?

Why does the Trust have to justify and account for every single thing they say, whilst you don't raise one question to the owners?

Lets talk about business then, lower league football clubs have an income of about £6m on average, and chose to spend around £6.3m. So for the club to be sustainable it needs to either raise an additional £300k or more and or reduce costs. NTFC loses around £500k per year whilst DC actually managed to run almost at break even.

So the question is... Can Northampton with 100+ years of history, with a population of 250k and another 250k in surrounding areas, in a relatively wealthy area with many businesses, small and large, raise an extra £300k plus per year? 

If the club was to get a share of any land development and so start an infrastructure foundation with £5m (the East stand would not have been developed at that point), isn't that something supporters and locals could get behind ?
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